Usborne Puberty Book tells children that breasts exist to make milk and to make girls look grown up and attractive

How very creepy to latch on a baby (how old is this baby because you have been here for a while newdaddie) to your sleeping partner. Could you not sit with your baby and comfort them whilst your partner roused herself?

And bless. You weren't aroused! How very creepy noble.

*not age appropriate

And maybe my (PFB) dd is a little bit more capable than yours.

Wow, what a knob you are.

Disgusted at the way this extract in the book was worded, it age appropriate at all. As if boys/men need any more of a reason to justify objectifying women and girls.

SophoclesTheFox

There are millions of women (and men) who are my equal. There are many millions more who are superior.

However, nothing you have written has led me to believe you are either.

"Why do you feel the need to shield them from the scientific method?"

My own future leaders are well versed in scientific method. Evopsych fairy tales of why human traits evolved have little to do with that though.

What's with these passive aggressive strike throughs of your snidey little comments?

You creeped me out with your comments about breasts and undressing your wife while she's asleep. And nothing you've written since has done anything but reinforce my belief that you do not view women as your equals.

I'd love to know what newdaddies wife thinks of his opinions on breasts.

TBF to NewDaddy I suspect the is talking about the theories espoused in Desmond Morris's "The Naked Ape" which may or may not be correct.

However, there is no need for young boys going through puberty to know this.

And maybe my (PFB) dd is a little bit more capable than yours.

And you're really not doing yourself any favours with comments like these.

newdaddie

Pubescent children are as young as eight years old. Of course there are a zillion things to shield them from, scientific or otherwise!

But I'm not talking about 'shielding' them from anything. I'm talking about how damaging it is to encourage both girls and boys to objectify females.

Telling boys (the book) and girls (your daughter) the breasts are there for men, is objectifying. I don't understand how you can't see this?

I'm afraid NewDaddie has lost all scientific credibility by appearing to conflate matriarchal and matrilinear. Unless of course his post was simply badly worded.

Yes, eye colour has definitely been well discussed academically and journalistically but tbh I'm not sure about lips. Also I vaguely remember reading about noses in the Middle East and how prominent noses were historically selected for and how globalisation has changed that view leading to rise in plastic surgery.

Wow. I'm amazed they would cover all that in an Usborne children's book.

And it's worth noting that men's insistence on fetishising women's breasts often have a detrimental effect on the woman and her relationship with said breasts.

Many women are sick and tired of men's eyes constantly dropping down to the chest area. Fed up with being thought a 'bit of a goer', purely because she has large breasts.

The ubiquitous 'nice tits' brand of cat calling.

Wanting to educate young people about a fulfilling and mutually respectful sex life will have the opposite effect if boys are being encouraged to objectify women in this way.

Datun pubescent children are not infants. Why do you feel the need to shield them from the scientific method? Why do you not trust them to succeed regardless of our evolutionary past? Horseshoe theory applies here. I think you're closer to the patriarchy than you'd like to admit to yourself.

I plan to give dd all the information whether it's convenient or not.

Why?

I have more faith in the next generation. And maybe my (PFB) dd is a little bit more capable than yours.

HTH

I believe that there is a school of thought that breasts evolved to reflect the buttocks, and the lips, the labia, once we were walking upright.

Even if this is true, is it right to introduce pubescent boys to the idea that breasts are there for them to find attractive? If it is hardwired then the boys will find that out on their own, and if it's not then you are introducing this idea that women exist to be visually attractive.

Surely given the level of male violence it is important to instill in boys that women do not just exist to give them pleasure?

It strikes me as the epitomy of a world where men are the default, for someone to say "I like breasts. Men like breasts. Therefore, women have breasts because men like them".

To me, it's much more obviously: Women have breasts to feed babies.(important full stop) That is a difference between men and women. Men have come to like them.

Do you think they also wrote about eyes and lips 'secondary' functions of looking attractive? If not, why not?

Yes, eye colour has definitely been well discussed academically and journalistically but tbh I'm not sure about lips. Also I vaguely remember reading about noses in the Middle East and how prominent noses were historically selected for and how globalisation has changed that view leading to rise in plastic surgery.

My understanding is that men from my culture view breasts (and bums and the rest of the naked female form) the same way UK men appreciate lips or eyes or other sexually attractive features that are uncovered in the UK.

Do you think they also wrote about eyes and lips 'secondary' functions of looking attractive? If not, why not?

I have 'attacked' the argument.

It's just your wording is a bit off. From asserting you will tell your pubescent daughter that her breasts are there for men and undressing your wife in the middle of the night to latch the baby on.

The latter, at a stretch, could just be considered in the way you subsequently explained it, but nonetheless the wording used had at least two of the women on here thinking it was creepy.

Yup,

When you can't attack the argument then you have to attack the person.

It's more than a bit pathetic.

I would cringe too if I were you. Thank God I'm not

Ohhhhh.

Yeah dd is definitely a PFB lol

(Although due to colonisation the state is arguably patriarchal but the monarchy and peerages are matrilineal)

Matrilineal is not the same as matriarchal.

And I doubt your claims.

We know how women from patriarchal cultures act when talking to men, and you don't really give the impression of being a man from a matriarchal culture.

I mean, shouldn't you acknowledge that we have the ovaries of objectivity and defer to our vastly superior knowledge?

@gillybeanz I might make a lighthearted thread in AIBU. And we have zero doubt that dd will be a leader but in the broad sense at being the best at whatever she chooses to do.

That said however after seeing her in action at playgroup she definitely seems to have 'head of state' calibre. And at 12months old she is already a Machiavellian strategist in the way she gets around any of my firm no's with beard pulling, hugs and giggles.

That dd of mine is definitely a boss baby 😅

PFB is precious first born.