UK gym to admit self ID'ing men into womens changing rooms

What gym is it?
And safeguarding in not, oh if something happens , then we will act. FFS .
I’d love to know what their insurers think.

One for Ocado?!

Target (a chain store in the US) lost $15 billion after they let anybody use the women's bathroom and then allocated $20 million for floor to ceiling cubicles trying to lure customers back. Doesn't matter, many women still won't shop there and two years later Target still hasn't recovered their former profit margins.

Wow that's interesting.

AndNowItIsSeven

I am obviously happy to wait if another disabled customer is using it, but why should I wait while a non disabled man uses it?

It isn't a non-disabled man who'd be using it - the suggestion is that those nasty un-educated women use it, if we're going to be so difficult about having penises in our space. As with Girl Guides, the ones who'll be ousted are any natal females who feel uncomfortable with the new order.

How about just cancel your gym membership? Money gets their attention like nothing else.

The strike against the Ocado (is that how it's spelled?) grocery store worked super well didn't it?

Businesses are not having it so easy in today's economy and cannot afford to lose half it's customer base. Target (a chain store in the US) lost $15 billion after they let anybody use the women's bathroom and then allocated $20 million for floor to ceiling cubicles trying to lure customers back. Doesn't matter, many women still won't shop there and two years later Target still hasn't recovered their former profit margins.

My question is what should I tell my 15 yo DD she should do to keep herself safe if she finds herself alone in the open plan changing room of our gym with a be-penised man?

Maybe it's time to enlist our dhs etc help here. Instead of man Friday, woman Wednesday? Get the men in our life to self id as women and just hang around changing rooms etc. Show that it can and will happen. I know it'll make some women uncomfortable in the rooms, but it's nothing to what would happen if self id goes through...

Or we could discuss the potential problems with management before some poor woman or girl gets flashed, photographed for some creepshots site, or worse.

I've read the thread but can't see the gym name. Have you given it?

It's so predictable to accuse women of getting het up, making a fuss etc.

Sit back. Women are allowed to say no to men. It doesn't mean they're getting het up over nothing. It means they're saying no.

I think we are being to submissive and nice about this. NO PENIS in female changing rooms. I wouldn’t entertain using a facility that allowed it.

I sure as hell would not wait to find myself in the situation where I am scared...in a confined space with noone else present except for me and him, I will not take chances on my safety.

I would not have renewed either.

Josuk

Every time I have been flashed at or in some other way been non-consentingly drawn into a man's (or boys/teens) sexual kicks, it has seared itself into my memory banks. It only has to happen once, a split second event, to leave a deep impression which alters ones approach. Checking and re-checking when entering a space for example.

You are what is commonly known as 'lucky'. You are not a better person for being blasé.

If and when that happens, and if that becomes an issue - I am sure we can, them discuss it with management.

The problem with waiting and hoping it never comes up, is that the poor woman or child who is affected has then to deal with it then and there. If harm is done, it’s then too late.

I think you were right not to renew your membership. Do you have friends who use the gym?

Perhaps there are other things you can do, depending on your circumstances. Obviously keep yourself safe.

Could you write a letter to head office, complaining about the changes and explain they are the reason you will not be renewing. Point out the Equalities Act and say it is legal for them to keep their facilities single sex. They will very likely have been informed otherwise.

Can you publicise these changes and urge others to do the same?

If you’re feeling courageous, organise a ManFriday event. Perhaps there are some Mumsnetters who would join you.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

I am going to write to my gym today which is a large national gym. I wondered if anyone had a template with a similar letter to another gym.

Some would say it's fast becoming a sign of just how progressive and right-on a person thinks they are too.

Screw the fact that they aren't being progressive, right on or even considering the real-life threats and detrimental effects their "I'm so cool and down with the kids" attitude is having on an entire sex though.

RogueBiscuit

No, it's not 'legal'. That's partly because it's not illegal. It's not illegal to use, certainly the toilets, of the opposite sex. It's up to the owner of the business.

Culturally it has been unacceptable. Except in dire cases of need.

Unfortunately, it's now culturally acceptable.

How is this happening, the bill hasn't gone through yet? Is this legal?

After DD's swimming class there is a women's swim session. This is predominantly used by Muslim women, many in burkinis. Huge gaggle of Somali women paying their entrance fee as we left. I assume once this law comes in it will be very difficult for these women to use the leisure centre as there will be no way to stop any man from swimming during this session. Quite aside from anything else that makes me very angry indeed, it's like the fucking oppression Olympics top trumps. Somali women are hardly over-involved in public life, many will be refugees, poorly educated, but hey, let's make life just that bit more bloody difficult for them, to please a bunch of narc males

I'm sure the BNP etc won't use these laws to 'identify' as women and kick Muslim women out of public spaces.

There is zero reason to segregate by gender identity. I can see someone's gender identity dangling out of their shorts.

Hiding I am a wheelchair user my local swimming pool has only one disabled cubicle. I am obviously happy to wait if another disabled customer is using it, but why should I wait while a non disabled man uses it?

Because it is a mental illness? What needs to happen really is we need to start making everything suitable for everyone. Disabled/non disabled male female confused etc
I

They can now literally say 'I'm a woman" and casually

^OP - so is this all a hypothetical fear with you?
Have you actually ever seen a man presenting as a woman trying to enter your gym/changing room?^

It's not that you sound unduly sensitive, more that I can't understand why such a highly hypothetical event bothers you.

^go to a large and busy gym. I don't know what their policy on this issue is. In my years of visiting that gym - I have not seen men presenting as women in my changing room, or on a gym floor.
If and when that happens, and if that becomes an issue - I am sure we can, them discuss it with management.^

And sex offenders, dressing up as women to sneak into our changing rooms.... Really?

I am sorry but have you really never heard of men trying to covertly look at women naked? Or wanting expose themselves to women?
really never? you've clearly lived in some magical unicorn land without male sexual assault, please do give the rest of us the coordinates.

Why do you think all those men will continue to pervenon women in trains and parks and hope for a bit of naked flesh via mirror under a toilet door and risk prison^ when thy can not literally say I'm a woman and causally saunter in to a room full of naked women?

The changing and showering areas are sex segregated, yes. You wear a swimming costume after you have showered so using the pools/lagoons is the same as here.

Were the spas sex segregated in Iceland? I'd happily shower naked around women but definitely couldn't do the same around men.

I'm also just back from a holiday in Iceland, and I thought about this when I was there. Everyone must shower naked before using the pool - they are extremely strict about this - no exceptions. I did notice that there were a few shower cubicles and changing cubicles in the pool we visited each day. But even supposing an individual choose to keep themselves covered in the communal areas, they would still be able to see everyone else naked, and it would change the whole atmosphere and freedom of the place.

Organised exercise isn't really my thing, and I'm not a member of a gym, but I found that I found it really liberating to be able to wander about showers and changing rooms with other women and girls, of all ages and shapes, and all naked.