I am Jazz. ***Trans content. Please do not open if you just want to post insults or whinge about another trans thread***

@Datun - question for you ...

I've been thinking of late that a return to the old category of body dysmorphia might be useful in order to distinguish those trans people who really think that their body is 'wrong', in the same way as other dysmorphias are about being fat/thin, thinking a limb is 'wrong' etc. from those who 'want to be a girl because they like sparkly stuff and this does not sit well with a penis' - i.e. 'gender dysphoria'. In the old days I used to read of transsexuals (as they were known, and I understand why this word is not liked) knowing that they should not have a penis or just being generally horrified by the primary and secondary sexual characteristics of their bodies. Now I read that many people 'want to live as a man', 'can't live as a woman', 'know that they are trans because they like things associated with the other gender'. Personally, I think that many of this ilk are simply confused or have bought into rigid stereotypes, but 'gender dysphoria' might explain their situations. I just think this is so radically different from body dysmorphia. What do you think?

SophoclesTheFox

The issue has become political. When it is actually medical.

There are so many reasons for people to call themselves transgender. If you break it down, it includes cross dressing fetishists, disassociative disorder, escape from restrictive gender roles, gender dysphoria.

It is fully accepted that there is not a one size fits all. In which case, we need different categories. Because giving civil rights to people who are discriminated against because they have gender dysphoria should not mean that those same rights go to cross dressing fetishists.

Surely these children, even if the operations or procedures have been done privately here (wtf???) or abroad should have social services involvement here for severe physical abuse?
I cant believe this is going on

This thread is a heartbreaking read.

That poor kid.

I thought your list of questions above was excellent, Datun. These are topics which absolutely must be discussed, and we must keep on discussing them here, because here is where the parents are, who could easily be guilted and hoodwinked onto the bandwagon. I just hope people can get over their knee jerk "this is transphobia", and really get to grips with the reality of what transing children does to them.

It's illegal, I believe to administer hormones to anyone under age in this country. Although you can do it privately. Helen Webberley famously sterilised a 12-year-old girl girl doing just that. She's also the one who prescribes hormones on the basis of a 17 second assessment.

Susie Green is the head of Mermaids, a support group for parents with trans children. She took her son, aged 12, I believe, abroad to get hormones, and to Thailand at 16 for genital surgery.

Mermaids is the go to group when addressing anything in the public about trans, including government legislation. None of the people running it are medically qualified.

Mermaids is responsible for misrepresenting the suicide statistics. Within hours of their presentation, it was repeated over, and over across the board. It was presented in such a way that the claim was, that of 2000 people interviewed, 41% had attempted suicide. When in actual fact, only 27 of those 2000 people were trans. Only eight of whom had contemplated suicide in the last year. Even the authors of the survey said caution should be used as the survey was self selected by people who could already be having issues. And that instances of self harm could have been presented as a suicide attempt.

It's also worth noting that this figure is only marginally higher than any other minority group. Including LGB youth in general.

I'm not, for a single second suggesting that anyone should ignore suicidal ideation in children. But the Samaritan guidelines expressly say to play down the notion of suicide as an option amongst children, or anyone. Ideation can pick up speed very quickly if you think you are a member of a cohort who is susceptible.

The point is, I see no benefit in frightening parents (or children) by misrepresenting figures. Other than to push an agenda. Life is difficult enough for parents of children with gender dysphoria.

Also, given 2000 children went to a gender clinic last year, if suicide was that prevalent you would be seeing one a week. I can't find any reports of teen trans suicide in the UK. Happy to be corrected. But when you google it, all you get is the stats quoted by Mermaids, not any reports.

Mermaids were told by a judge to have nothing to do with a child whose mother said was trans. The child went to live with his father and Mermaids were forbidden any further contact as the judge thought the child was not trans at all. They took to Twitter criticising the judge. Calling him ignorant. Despite the fact that the judge is the foremost advocate in terms of trans law and has written the forward for a book about same-sex families.

It's said that you cannot make a child trans. Which to me should mean you can't manufacture gender dysphoria in a child. But it sounds subtely different. Because you can have gender dysphoria, without ending up trans.

Even if Jazz is genuinely trans, whatever you take that to mean, I still think that this treatment, or cure is completely wrong.

This is child abuse, I would liken it to FGM as pps have. Jazz's parents should be utterly ashamed of themselves.

What I can't get my head round is what the fact Jazz liked tutus etc as a toddler, and now fancies boys as a tween, has anything to do with Jazzs sex- this is gender stereotyping and homophobia at its very worst - and people seem to think it's all very right on and modern, it's really not, it's terrifying.

Poor Jazz. This is heartbreaking and it's absolutely unbelievable that it's been allowed.

I guess we can expect a lot more of it in the future. Until, as seems inevitable, the consequences start to kick in for Jazz and the others after Jazz and the world starts to come to its senses.

I wish there were a way back for Jazz.

AdalindSchade This article links to research about twins refuting the 'born in the wrong body' idea: dailysignal.com/2017/07/03/im-pediatrician-transgender-ideology-infiltrated-field-produced-large-scale-child-abuse

In my darker moments, I wonder if this is some fundy plot to castrate gay males and stop them having sex.....

All these sweet fey gay boys- are they to be just loaded up with hormones and condemned to having their penis removed and replaced with rotting flesh?

Yes Gina I remember that and the outcry yet even the likes of the BBC promote transing children.

I also suspect the future will reveal the massive and insidious influence drugs companies will have had on all of this.

"Children as young as three" that should say.

Children are being referred by the NHS to gender identity clinics. Don't think for a second it's not happening here.

Does anyone else remember the outrage years ago when a family of severely disabled girl who needed full care wanted to delay puberty so the family could continue to take care of her and stop her from having periods she couldn't take care of? How did we go from that to letting children choose to do that?

Yes definitely. It seems common sense that flooding a child's body with artificial hormones before puberty will have adverse physical and mental effects

I suspect with the female hormones that Jazz's XY body would not normally be exposed to and the natural male hormones supresssed there's going to be a huge medical issue not too far in the future.

If you don't naturally have the the receptors etc to deal with these hormones there has to be massive side effects at some point.

(I'm a scientist and though this isn't my field I see the effects introducing anything artificial, even prescribed drugs, has).

It will be interesting to see if children's commissioner position is ever clarified
Or chief medical officer should be wading in

It will be interesting to see if children's commissioner position is ever clarified
Or chief medical officer should be wading in

And that's the other thing. 16 year olds appearing on reality TV shows. Exploitation

I really hope that if this was over here people like the children's commissioner would intervene and help to halt this madness

America.
Why is this not abuse?
Does America deal with fgm?

Sorry it's not jazz who is a twin though they do have twin brothers. It was these ones I was thinking of. Adopted as babies and not allowed to like girly things...
www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-3274371/Identical-twins-born-boys-family-coped-one-came-transgender-transitioned-Wyatt-Nicole.html

Isn't jazz an identical twin? How does the 'hormone wash' or 'born in the wrong body' narrative work with identical twins?

"Yesterday 16:31 CosmicPineapple

Transing children is child abuse."
Yes. This is horrendous. I've never come across jazz before, what country is this all happening in?

If jazz will never go through puberty then surely that will have major health and development implications for life?

And yes to the pp who said surely jazz could have been a normal camp adolescent boy who wore dresses and make up if he wanted to. With no long term harm.
This is absolutely awful.

Get your colours done newbie. I find a yellow bow sets mine off nicely