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What I mean is, it's obvious once it's been pointed out, but I had never thought of it

This is how I feel about SO MANY ISSUES as I become more and more aware of feminist thinking. Once you start seeing these things, you come to understand the world in a different, much less flattering light. Ignorance may be bliss - but then we end up contributing to our own oppression. Realising that women are in no way immune from perpetuating sexism and misogyny was a massive lightbulb moment for me.

There are lots of amazing books out there - I'm sure there used to be a reading list thread around here somewhere. My approach has been, very gradually interspersed with my other reading, to alternate a 'modern' book (such as most of the ones already suggested on this thread - am currently on 'Wifework' by Susan Maushart) with a 'classic' (Greer, de Beauvoir, Friedman etc) to try and gain 'historical' perspective as well.

Have you heard of the Bechdel test? A useful little rule to evaluate films and put them in context as to how much they normalise sidelining women.

Listen to radio 4's women's hour podcasts as well, i learn loads from there. The guilty feminist podcast is ace too, very funny but covers important issues too.

Welcome! Be prepared to feel anger, despair, fear, concern.... but the gradual confidence to stand up against discrimination with the solidarity of your sisters supporting you

I'm another one who seconds Cordelia Fine's Delusions of Gender.

Once you realise that it's nurture, not nature, a lot of things start to fit into place.

I'm as guilty as anyone of buying into the whole damn system for most of my life, whilst at the same time thinking soo frequently, hang on a minute. Once you connect the dots, they are chained together. There is no going back. It's obvious, and it makes so much sense.

Similar to you, it was the trans thing that woke me up to feminism in the first place.

I was immediately outraged, so I lurked on the feminist boards to find out more.

Now I'm a proud feminist. And I'll tell anyone.

It's like I was going through life without a road map. Now I have one. It sometimes takes me to places I don't want to go, though!

Well done and welcome. It's brilliant that you can raise your family with feminismist awareness.

And I honestly think mumsnet has done a lot to raise awareness of feminism.

The logic is just undeniable.

(What I mean is, it's obvious once it's been pointed out, but I had never thought of it.)

a whole chapter on "no means no," and how, in ordinary conversation, people of both sexes don't use a straight "no". People typically defuse tension/avoid conflict by a more roundabout refusal - "I'd love to come for a drink after work, but I've got something else on..." She points out that men not only understand this sort of style of discourse in non-sexual contexts, they typically use it themselves. So the pretence that "she didn't convey her 'no' clearly enough" is exactly that - a pretence, used to excuse criminal behaviour, not a genuine failure in understanding.

Off topic I guess, but this has left me sitting here like this:

It's so obvious isn't it?

All of Andrea Dworkins books are available to download as Ebooks, free of charge (you can make a donation)
radfem.org/dworkin/

I suggest you start with Right Wing women.

Recommend the books above as well as Germaine Greer's Female Eunuch...Pretty old now but still resonates and I can honestly say it opened my eyes.
Once you're aware, you can never look back and you sadly realise how unequal the world is & how much feminism is needed, everywhere!

Kat Bayard's equality illusion is really good as well.

All this looks like you need to be really well read to take part, but you really don't. A lot of us read a lot through interest, or because the types of trolls we get on this part of the forum tend to go away if you send facts that they can't disprove at them.

Welcome. Welcome to the dark side. We have robust debates, but I've rarely met a finer bunch of women.

Don't want to swamp you with reading, but depending on your own personal leanings, I really enjoyed both Lise Elliott and Deborah Cameron.

Lise Elliott's Pink Brain, Blue Brain is about the neuroscience of brain plasticity in early childhood and why it's impossible to answer the nature/nurture question, and why in any case the differences are nigh-on undetectable anyway.

Deborah Cameron's The Myth of Mars and Venus is more of a social science approach. She brilliantly debunks the "women talk 7 times as much" urban myth, and also has a whole chapter on "no means no," and how, in ordinary conversation, people of both sexes don't use a straight "no". People typically defuse tension/avoid conflict by a more roundabout refusal - "I'd love to come for a drink after work, but I've got something else on..." She points out that men not only understand this sort of style of discourse in non-sexual contexts, they typically use it themselves. So the pretence that "she didn't convey her 'no' clearly enough" is exactly that - a pretence, used to excuse criminal behaviour, not a genuine failure in understanding.

I really recommend reading Cordelia Fine's Delusions of Gender www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0079LSJ6A?tag=mumsnetforum-21

I read it when it was first released and it was a revelation - finally! I had something to counter the "well it's natural that you'll want to give up your career" and "it's been proven that women are more empathetic and suited to softer skills^ which i had a fuckton of from my nearest and dearest

This is good for some facts:

www.unwomen.org/en/digital-library/publications/2015/4/progress-of-the-worlds-women-2015

There is a section just on the developed world, if you're particularly interested in that.

Read Caitlin Moran's "how to be a woman" and then come back!
What things are you interested in?
Menstrual taboo and the fact women around the world drop out of education and even die because they are on their period particularly depresses me.
In this country, rapes and cases like the recent choking/manslaughter one.

Id kinda like to know too if you don't mind me joint you awaiting for replies?

I never really thought to much about stuff is see stuff that id think is/was unfair but always took things on an Individual basis rather than link it to part of a "bigger problem"

I have 2 Dds one is due to start secondary school in just over a yr and with the threads on single sex schools and all the uniform threads 're skirt lengths and all the threads stating how girls are dressing like "little hookers" etc things are starting to worry about how the worl really is and how it's going to be for my dd. Everything from those stupid victim blaming posters to the use of the words "fireman" and "policeman" in dd2s reading books.
.i never used to be that aware or pissed off at these things.

MN has alot to answer for