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Original poster

Should I complain to the school?

168 replies

junerat · 28/06/2017 13:01

My DD4 is due to start school in September. It is a brand new school - her year will be the first ever reception class, and I'm really excited about helping to "build the ethos" of a whole new school. I really, very much want to be an active part of her school community, not just someone who moans!

I am also very sensitive to feminist issues, and my DD is too - she will always notice when there aren't enough female characters in a book, for example.

We have just been sent the induction packs for her new school. They have a house system, with the four houses named after local famous historical figures. Every single one of the four houses is named after a man.

I sort of understand (but still hate) it when a school has been established for x number of years and has a patriarchal system, but this a brand new school, and they seem not to have taken the opportunity to start off on an equal footing.

When I met the headmaster, I mentioned to him that the "girls' uniform" didn't include trousers, was my daughter welcome to wear them? He was fine and flexible with this, so I do think he's a reasonable person. Though it is a part of an academy trust, so very, very likely not his decision re: house names.

It may be too late to change the names of the houses (literature has already been printed), but if it is an academy trust, could speaking up stop this from happening at the next school that opens?

My husband thinks I'm talking absolute nonsense and it's a total non-issue, but I hate that my daughter will see four male "role models" as the pillars of the school, and not even a nod to the (very eminent) female historical figures from this area.

I categorically do not want to forge a poor relationship with this school though and do not want to become "that parent". Any thoughts?

OP posts:
hipsterfun · 30/06/2018 19:27

Firstly, what about the pioneers? Thatcher (I know), Obama. Dany Cotton. They became what they couldn’t see.

Secondly, it suggests the need to have a representative in every role of every identity, or combination thereof, that can be imagined in order for others to follow. But how can anyone follow if nobody has been able to go first because they had nobody to follow?

Thirdly, what do you need to be able to ‘see’ anyway? What does it mean and why is it important? It seems to me to narrow things down to identities rather than interests, aptitude etc.

Bottom line: thought-limiting, meme-y oversimplification.

(I’m grumpy today, sorry Smile)

OvaHere · 30/06/2018 19:11

I missed this thread when it started but just wanted to say you absolutely did the right thing raising it and I'm sorry you've had a less than satisfactory outcome.

I think the school are seriously underplaying this. It's a new school FFS starting with a fresh template, the fact they made no real attempt to factor equality into house names is shocking. If they really couldn't be bothered to find some inspirational women they could have gone for inanimate objects instead like local landmarks.

I'm incredibly annoyed now having read this thread (not your fault op).

On a more positive note this is something you can talk to your daughter about when she is a little older and explain how you tried to change things. Maybe she will do an assembly piece on it one day, especially if the head moves on - male academy heads tend to move about a lot in my experience.

Original poster
junerat · 30/06/2018 17:58

@hipsterfun In what way? I mean yes, at a detail level it's true (it's possible to become an accountant without ever having met one) but I think it's broadly true if girls never see a female firefighter they are less likely to want to become one.

OP posts:
hipsterfun · 30/06/2018 15:24

(This isn’t very helpful to the thread, but ‘You can't be what you can't see’ is nonsense and I wish people would stop saying it.)

Original poster
junerat · 30/06/2018 15:15

I just wanted to give an update on this, though I do need to be a bit cagey, as I very much want to stay anonymous.

As a new school, a few of us were invited to give the Dept of Education visitor some feedback on the school. I mentioned this issue, and another parent agreed with me. It was subsequently reported to the governors as an issue to be looked at.

So far, so good, and some progress.

However, the way they have addressed this is by asking the parents in a survey a yes/no question, "Should we change the house names?" with no context around it. I would be astonished if anyone other than me and one other person clicked yes because 99% of people don't care, and the other 1% are very traditional.

Even my own daughter was upset at the thought at first of her house name possibly changing, as she understandably feels loyalty towards her house which she has been in for an academic year now.

The head is very open minded (I think) but also very swayed by parents' opinion. He did raise the issue that if they represented women, then could it be seen as not representing gay, disabled, different ethnicities etc.?

I want to raise with the school that I don't think they've gone the best way about this - surely a school should be setting themselves up as thought leaders, rather than going on popular opinion. I have a decent relationship with the head, so would be happy to talk to him face to face, but there is so much I want to say, that I'm wondering if an email might be better, so I don't end up gabbling about tokenism, non-feminist parents and so on.

We live in an area with a high pupil premium and a lot of parents who "don't care" - if they don't care enough to take time to do reading/homework with their children, I'm 100% sure they don't give a tiny shit about gender stereotypes and how to smash them.

Any advice re: way forward would be really appreciated, otherwise I think the response is going to be, "Following feedback that some parents felt that the house names needed to reflect women, we asked parents the question and 92% of parents feel strongly house names should stay the same".

OP posts:
Datun · 10/07/2017 06:51

junerat

It's a bit out of order that he hasn't replied to your email. And I hope that the other mother does write.

Perhaps he's still taking advice from colleagues?

Original poster
junerat · 09/07/2017 21:23

Just wanted to update on this (as I'm sure you're all on the edge of your seats). The head didn't speak to me on the transition day, but it was very hectic.

We had a school picnic today, which was lovely, and once again, he didn't speak to me about it, so I am assuming that as far as he's concerned, he's said his piece, and I've said mine, and he doesn't see a further need to reply to my email. We said a quick hello and goodbye, but neither of us raised the topic.

I mentioned the issue to another mother who attends the same playgroup we go to, and she said today that having thought about it, she also feels strongly that it's wrong not to include any women, so she will also drop a quick email to him in a few days. I'm obviously not going to chase her up on this - it needs to be her call, but would be great to get more voices supporting it. I just hope he doesn't think I'm orchestrating some sort of campaign behind his back, which genuinely isn't the case.

Anyway, no exciting resolution, but was conscious I hadn't updated when I'd promised to.

OP posts:
QueenOfTheSardines · 05/07/2017 20:10
Smile
Original poster
junerat · 04/07/2017 22:16

Great Nightingale info, thank you!

Just realised I'm a day ahead of myself and I won't see the head until Thursday, but will take on board trying to defer the conversation if needs be. To be fair to him - if he is indeed planning on talking to me - he would have no way of knowing that my youngest is going to be with me, so I don't think it would be a deliberate "let's make it difficult to have a proper conversation" tactic.

OP posts:
QueenOfTheSardines · 04/07/2017 20:42

Just read this thread

Wanted to say that on Florence Nightingale

You need to say to the Head

" I am so pleased that the children will be learning about The Lady with the Hammer" and smile sweetly.

florence nightingale

Datun · 04/07/2017 12:41

junerat

If the head intends to catch you on the hop, when you cannot devote your full attention to what he's saying, I would decline the conversation.

I know you want to keep relationships cordial, but this, to me would just be another example of sexism.

I might be tempted to think beforehand of a decent sentence to defer the conversation to a time when it's convenient to you both, not just him.

SpaghettiAndMeatballs · 04/07/2017 12:23

I'm also a lot better when I have time to reflect with the written word, than the spoken.

I've found it helpful (albeit time-consuming and possibly a touch weird) to go through possible conversation points in my head, and have some prepared responses - otherwise I often fall over my words, or kick myself for forgetting some important point.

Original poster
junerat · 04/07/2017 12:19

Just wanted to update. I still haven't heard anything from the school, although I have a transition day with my daughter tomorrow. I suspect the headteacher may use this opportunity to speak to me. I will, however, have my youngest with me. As she's a toddler, it's not going to be a great time for a conversation, but there you go.

I'm also a lot better when I have time to reflect with the written word, than the spoken.

OP posts:
Datun · 01/07/2017 13:42

OK. I'll message you.

Original poster
junerat · 01/07/2017 12:50

@Datun Nope, not B. Well, actually the suburb starts with B, but not the town itself. Happy to take this to PM if you want!

OP posts:
Datun · 01/07/2017 12:34

junerat

he's probably having to consult umpteen other people to make sure he doesn't say the wrong thing.

As a matter of interest, the town that this school is in doesn't begin with B, does it?

Original poster
junerat · 01/07/2017 12:28

No reply from the school yesterday, but I appreciate that he probably wants time to formulate his response, plus this is probably item 999 on his list of things to do, with the school not even physically built yet...

Will keep you all posted.

OP posts:
ErrolTheDragon · 30/06/2017 23:41

Yeah, my DD has been on a few things for budding engineers where girls from other (mixed) sixth forms have been gobsmacked by the number of girls in her physics class. Though its still not that many ... but more do further maths and the most populous subjects are maths and chemistry.

The main problem with all girls schools is, perhaps, 'what about the boyz'... although recent research suggests they too do better academic in single sex schools (though only marginally), I'm not sure whether it's good for their socialisation.

chopchopchop · 30/06/2017 17:53

The stats on how many girls take A Level physics in single sex girls vs mixed schools are insane, it's four times as many. That alone is enough to convince me.

Datun · 30/06/2017 16:54

I'm getting more and more convinced that sex segregated schools is of great benefit to girls.

NoLoveofMine · 30/06/2017 15:23

It's great your daughter has found schools she loves the look of and have feminist posters up chopchopchop! I go to a girls' school and love it. We have a thriving Feminist Society and it's a wonderful place to be educated; year groups all support one another, former pupils come back regularly to speak of their career paths and there's a strong feeling of camaraderie which transcends age groups. I know a few girls at other girls' schools who speak similarly of theirs and am sure your daughter will love hers when she starts secondary school. It's also fantastic she's noticing features such as feminist posters and seeing them as being an important factor in her decision.

On another note I do think it's a shame such posters and sentiment is seemingly not as prevalent at mixed schools though. Ideally I'd like single sex education not to be preferable for these reasons one day.

chopchopchop · 30/06/2017 14:55

Sign DD up for the feminist school please, she'd love it.

We're currently looking at secondary schools and she's currently in favour of the all girls schools. when I asked her why, she said that when she went round them, the girls schools were covered in feminist posters, and the mixed schools weren't. She's not wrong, either.

OlennasWimple · 30/06/2017 13:15

That's the beauty of the free school programme: literally anyone can apply to open up any sort of school...

KatherinaMinola · 30/06/2017 11:57

if I were in the head's unfortunate position, I would be wary of being "pushed" into something by a parent, as it sets a precedent

I don't agree with this at all. I try to be open to feedback (not always easy, I know) and can think of a few times I've permanently changed my way of working in response to it - or in response to a lightbulb moment that someone's triggered in me. I think having a "listening" attitude is particularly important in a headteacher. It doesn't mean you have to be blown about by every breeze but you should ask yourself "does this person have a point?"

At the first meeting of his MA, DH pulled the convenor up on the fact that all the people they were going to study were male and white. The convenor blushed, stammered, said he hadn't noticed - and had it sorted by the next seminar. He and DH are still in touch ten years later Smile.

Not everyone is entrenched in their attitudes (although on the evidence so far it does look like your HT is).

FlorenceLyons · 30/06/2017 11:25

That's a brilliant follow-up email, junerat, and I agree that the various suggested tweaks strengthen it even further. Personally I don't think mentioning Ofsted needs to be perceived as a threat at all - just strengthening your position by pointing out that others, including one of the most influential bodies in UK education, share your views on the importance of sex equality in schools.

I'd love to see the school do the brave and decent thing and change their minds on this before it goes any further. If they handled it right, it could actually refelect very well on them.