Twitter and where to begin with comments about "terfs"

This just popped up on my twitter feed

I've been relieved to find how many feminists are standing up against the "trans cult" if I may call it that - I'd almost given up hope before I came here! It worries me hugely how accepted it seems to be amongst so many (particularly of my age) and how any deviation from the enforced line is met with accusations of bigotry.

I have Caitlin to thank for my first summiting the peak of Mount Transactivist

There was not, is not, and is no prospect of ever being an Olympic Decathlon event for women. The person who won that event in Montreal in 1976 was lionised at the time for being the very model of athletic masculinity and built his career on that. And someone genuinely wanted me to agree that this person had always known that they were a woman, just the same as I am a woman, and that history should be rewritten on that basis!

I can't ever agree to that, no matter whose feelings get hurt in the process.

It was the Brazilian penis waxing for me. I thought it was simply fucked that the Equal Opportunity Commission said there was a case for discrimination.

Ioc snd dpirts for me - it's judt do crazy, unfair and clearcut. How TAs and supporters can keep saying TW/TGs have no advsntsge an even if they did - it's not winning that's important but being understanding and inclusive. Fries my brain!

I was recruited to TERFness by threads on Mumsnet as well. At first I was horribly fascinated by the appalling bigotry, but the strident and crisp and logical arguments won me over.

That's interesting Butter. I knew very little about it and was therefore neutral, but was recruited to terfery after a day on mumsnet. The IOC threads, actually.

What was it that clicked for you?

It's always useful to know what the tipping point is.

"No you're the transphobic bigot!"

You could go round in circles forever.

*sorry, I think it was probably she knew she was Caitlin. Important to get these things right!

I'd sign that!

I went down the rabbit hole with some true believers over Bruce's sporting achievements and it was an absolute masterclass in cognitive dissonance.

True Believer: Caitlin Jenner won the Olympic Decathlon! Isn't that progressive and amazing that she could achieve that?
Me: No, Bruce Jenner did.
TB: Bruce was always Caitlin
Me: But by all indications, you have to admit that Bruce was male when he won the olympic decathlon
TB: Well, he knew he was Caitlin.
Me: so he should have competed in the women's event? But there isn't a women's decathlon.
TB: BIGOT.
Me:

Perhaps we should start a liberal feminist petition saying that it is transphobic for the IOC not to scrub Bruce Jenner from their records, as he wasn't eligible at the time, being a genuine woman and all that.

Now that would help point out the illogical nature of it as men's privilege is not usually withdrawn in these situations. I can imagine the wording now...

SIGN THE PETITION AGAINST THE TRANSPHOBIC IOC!

We the undersigned demand that the IOC remove Caitlyn Jenner's deadname from the decathlon records. Caitlyn Jenner has always been a woman. We maintain that it is offensive, bigoted, transphobic and transmisogynist to insist that a woman won a man-only event. We demand that Guido Kratschmer of West Germany, the real male winner, be awarded the decathlon Gold Medal of the 1976 Montreal Olympics.

I love this suggestion from Donkey. I think it is a nice and clear statement that will help lurkers on their way to peak trans.
Gender identity doctrine is sexist and incoherent. A woman is an adult human female, not a feeling in a man's head.

I was recruited to TERFness by threads on Mumsnet as well. At first I was horribly fascinated by the appalling bigotry, but the strident and crisp and logical arguments won me over.

Yes Olenna - that is a perfect argument about Bruce/Caitlin! If he was always a woman he was not eligible. Give it back!

Or, if Caitlyn Jenner really did compete in the Olympics (because Bruce was always Cait), she should be disqualified for taking part in an event which is not open to women, and she should hand back her gold medal.

I don't understand why the IOC needs to change the official records: Bruce Jenner won the decathlon gold medal, in the same way that Jessica Ennis won the heptathlon Olympic gold medal in 2012, and Jessica Ennis-Hill won the heptathlon gold at the World Athletics Championships in 2015. It's not hard, is it?

The only consistent rule about when to treat trans women as men and when as women is: When it suits them

It suited Bruce to be a golf club member.

It suited Bruce to change the olympic record books to pretend that a woman had won the Ironman or whatever it was, even though as far as I am aware women aren't even allowed to compete.

It suited Bruce to become woman of the year.

They want their cake and eat it, and because they are male, and everyone knows it (despite pretending not to) they get to have it all.

A woman trying to identify as male for one day to apply for membership to a male-only golf club and then demand that they install women's toilets the next day would have her ass handed to her.
Probably she'd not even get them to install bins in the men's toilets, assuming she managed to get the club membership at all.

I thought Narcissa had problems with her hands so had to stop gaming for a while. So there is a reason for the no gaming. Back at it now though.

I find the deadnaming wierd though. It is seen as erasure but then some trans women are only part time and didn't Caitlyn Jenner still use her golf club under the name Bruce. While the olympic record books had to be amended.

After Narcissus from the Greek mythology, or after Mrs. Malfoy?

I'd guess the second one is more likely to be intended, but the first would fit a very large percentage of MtTs.

MrsGWay

That's the person I am talking about in the first post. I didn't know about that.

TinyRick

The current one is Alex Mauer who has been blitzing people with bullshit DMCA's and behaving increasingly unreasonably and erratically. Sid Alpha, Total Biscuit and Jim Sterling have all covered it this week.

The other one is the speed runner whose name is now Narcissa (yes really).

I wonder whether (and how) that gamer will react.

If I had become famous under my own last name, and took on that of a husband and people then hated on someone for speaking of my achievements, I'd be furious.

No, not the gamer just TRAs on the threads I think.

I can't remember where I saw this, but another speedrunner referred to the technique during a speedrun he was doing. This is an established glitch and so is known by name. Then loads of comments about deadnaming began, but not from the deadnamed person, just a load of keyboard warriors. They wouldn't listen to anyone else and it infuriated me so much I just leave.

It is like that video someone linked about a real life twitter argument. I watched a few minutes of it but cannot cope with these young adults who will not listen. So I had to switch it off.

Before he transitioned he found a glitch which was named after him. Now there are accusations of dead naming if it is referenced, not sure what the outcome is. Whether the technique has been renamed.

Nicely illustrates how harmful this is - he's seriously willing to give up his fame in favour of throwing temper tantrums over "deadnaming"?
Or is that just the transwacktivists?

Interesting point about gaming, I am a Zelda fan and there is a gamer who speedruns one in particular. Before he transitioned he found a glitch which was named after him. Now there are accusations of dead naming if it is referenced, not sure what the outcome is. Whether the technique has been renamed.

Miffer Are you able to link to the two MtTs you mentioned? I'm a gamer too so interested to read about it.

Miffer

I don't do gaming, I'm too old. but reading several Facebook sites about transactivism, commenters will often point out that the profile pics of activists are of hyper sexualised anime.

I'm treading in unfamiliar territory here, because as I said, I don't game, neither do I look at anime.

But the connection between gaming, anime and transwomen seems very strong.

They often use acronyms in their comments, that are particular to gaming.

Datun

Yes, there is definitely something in that. I came across that person while reading about the latest gaming controversy which involves somebody else who identifies as a transwoman behaving abhorrently and blaming the backlash on transphobia.

I wonder if there are far more people who would consider themselves trans, if they had the gamers' outlook. Or whether it's just attracts those types.

Gaming probably attracts people who don't feel comfortable in their bodies, as it is a hobby where your body plays no role. It's one of the reasons I got into computer games in my teens. Not having males stare at my developing body was very appealing - in an online game, you just play a male character, problem solved.

However, I don't think the delusions have anything to do with the gaming.

There may well be more trans-identified gamers than non-gamers, but I think the number of deluded people, i.e. trans and trans allies counted together, is probably the same as in the general population.