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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Why is this a protest?

162 replies

Elendon · 22/06/2017 19:52

I understand that it's hot weather and the male students want to make a point but to do it with white shirts and ties and black shoes and socks? It's like wearing female clothing is abhorrent to them.

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bigolenerdy · 22/06/2017 20:57

Correction: doesn't imply that...

scallopsrgreat · 22/06/2017 20:57

That should read men are ridiculed and abused outside this obvious protest.

bigolenerdy · 22/06/2017 20:53

"...The fact than boys and men wouldn't be seen dead in a skirt or dress for the rest of the year implies that..."

No it does imply that at all Scallop. You are inferring that.

scallopsrgreat · 22/06/2017 20:53

So you are telling me Scarlett that the reason men don't wear skirts and dresses is because all their comfort needs are met by trousers? In that case why don't women and girls wear trousers all the time and we just do away with skirts and dresses? Why when men/boys wear dresses they are ridiculed and abused and pushed into the box called trans? Why are boys being even applauded for wearing skirts?

mybrain · 22/06/2017 20:50

I don't understand why shorts are so ground upon in the office..

For both men and women!

I worked in an office that had a very strict dress code, for both men and women, it's was routinely enforced, it was fair to both genders but incredibly rigid.

For both men and women:

No shorts at all
Only full length trousers
Shoes had to be a full shoe "smart" (not even a peep toe, smart was at the discretion of the manager, a girl got sent home for wearing 6 inch heeled court shoes, the heal was made out of some sort of clear plastic, to be fair they was horrific)
All tops had to have collars, but couldn't be polo shirts
Dresses and skirts to be worn to the knee
No body con style clothing
Shoulders must be covered at all times

Even on the monthly dress down day the no short rule, skirt length and shoulder covering was compulsory.

Drove me nuts, and I got athletes foot frequently in the summer, because I couldn't wear sling backs or peep toes bare legs wnd feet in a dress..

ScarlettFreestone · 22/06/2017 20:50

scallop I would suggest that it merely implies that the boys are happy to wear the traditional school uniform while it meets their needs for comfort.

Their protest isn't about gender norms, it's about the fact that they are too hot.

In my school days, many years ago, a group of girls successfully lobbied for trousers to be permissible following a particularly cold winter. For exactly the same reasons.

ScarlettFreestone · 22/06/2017 20:47

Elendon I've been polite to you, I'm unclear why you aren't extending me the same curtesy.

However, if you read the article you linked to the HT has in fact already said that in response to the protest, that they will consult on a change to the uniform code regarding shorts.

It would seem logical given that skirts for boys are allowed under the code, then if shorts are added in future they will also be allowable for girls.

Out of interest, I'm still wondering why black socks and shoes are outrageous?

scallopsrgreat · 22/06/2017 20:44

"Are you implying that skirts are lesser in some way?" I'm not implying that, no. The fact than boys and men wouldn't be seen dead in a skirt or dress for the rest of the year implies that.

TheLuminaries · 22/06/2017 20:43

But the boys are protesting for girls to be allowed to wear shorts, they are protesting to have a sensible summer uniform alternative for themselves. I don't see why that makes you so cross?

Elendon · 22/06/2017 20:42

A political statement?

What are you wittering on about Scarlett?

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Elendon · 22/06/2017 20:41

Scarlett your argument is that by wearing a skirt, shorts will be introduced and for both sexes. It's nonsense. It has all the intellectual nuance of a year 7 pupil.

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ScarlettFreestone · 22/06/2017 20:41

Elendon well it depends on the school. No one at my school was ever sent home because of their skirts.

However do you think that girls who wear skirts which are shorter than the regulations are doing so as an organised protest?

Do you think that they are trying to effect change or make a political statement?

bigolenerdy · 22/06/2017 20:39

Elendon - Honest question, are you deliberately being obtuse, or maybe trying to make some subtle point that I'm failing to grasp?

"...If they want an alternative to hot weather then wear the shorts and accept the fine. That way they are helping young women to wear shorts too..."

Why does their objective have to include helping young women? Why are you so keen on telling them how to protest?

ScarlettFreestone · 22/06/2017 20:38

I'm not sure I understand your argument scallop? Are you implying that skirts are lesser in some way? That the boys protest is denigrating the girls in some way?

Elendon · 22/06/2017 20:38

It's not a clever protest, it's one that has been done for the last few years.

A few days of hot weather and the teenage boys decide to go in wearing a skirt. All hail them for their cleverness and subverting the rules.

A teenage girl who wears a skirt that's deemed too short is sent home. She is not seen as clever for subverting the rules.

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ScarlettFreestone · 22/06/2017 20:35

I'm not sure why you think skirts or shorts with black socks and shoes is an outrage? Genuinely - I'm confused?

I wore a school skirt with black socks and shoes for years. My DD wears grey socks and black shoes with her uniform skirt or with her uniform shorts. As do lots of the other girls. Far more practical than white.

And their protest will help girls wear shorts if they are added to the dress code.

scallops but the point of the protest isn't to say "boys should be allowed to wear skirts". The point of this particular protest is to say "boys should be allowed a cooler option in hot weather"

And yes of course they are all sorts of reasons one might choose to a wear skirt, or not. But these boys aren't challenging the entire dress code, just the lack of shorts.

Why should their specific local protest have to be about the wider subject of gendered uniform? Why can't it just be a local protest by a group of young people trying to improve their particular learning environment?

scallopsrgreat · 22/06/2017 20:31

I don't think it's clever at all. They're happy with the dress code for the majority of the year clearly. When they don't get their own way, then the clothes which are predominantly worn by the girls are good enough. And they get a round of applause and cookies Hmm.

InLovewithaGermanFilmStar · 22/06/2017 20:30

I think it's a really clever protest. They're still wearing school uniform! One up to a silly uniform rule.

TheLuminaries · 22/06/2017 20:28

It is a clever protest because is subverts the rules and thus shows up how sill and arbitrary the rules are. Boys in shorts would just have got a punishment and not made the same point about arbitrary nature of the dress code, good for them I say. I think men look good in skirts and in many cultures it is quite usual for men to wear them.

scallopsrgreat · 22/06/2017 20:25

But why for the rest of the year is it only girls who wear the skirts? Surely there are some reasons other than hot weather to wear skirts? Otherwise girls wouldn't wear them either.

Elendon · 22/06/2017 20:25

Oh and this kind of protest is not new. It's being going on for years. Seems like the heads of the school like the publicity.

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Elendon · 22/06/2017 20:24

If they want an alternative to hot weather then wear the shorts and accept the fine. That way they are helping young women to wear shorts too.

Though I dare say that young teenage girls wearing shorts with black socks and shoes would be an outrage.

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ScarlettFreestone · 22/06/2017 20:17

scallop because the entire point is that they want a cooler alternative to their trousers in hot weather.

ScarlettFreestone · 22/06/2017 20:16

The uniform code includes skirts. The school can't discriminate by sex therefore there is no reason for the boys not to wear them.

However, it very effectively embarrasses the school and highlights the fact that the uniform code isn't broad enough.

Presumably if they add shorts to the dress code, some girls will choose to wear shorts.

Wearing shorts would not have embarrassed the school, would not have made the news, would not have effected any change.

They made an effective protest without breaking any rules.

I haven't seen any skirts that looked particularly short to be honest, but if they are too short I'd imagine it's because they've borrowed a motley collection of skirts from sisters and friends and they don't quite fit.

FlyingDuck · 22/06/2017 20:15

The reason they are wearing skirts and not shorts, is that the head teacher said (when they objected to hot trousers), something like, "why don't you come in skirts then?" So they took her at her word.