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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Learning about transgender issues

64 replies

WelshMoth · 30/04/2017 19:58

...from the point of view of a 15 yr old girl. She asked me whether I knew of any websites or suitable reading materials where she could learn about Transgender issues. I probed a bit, explained that it's a massive issue and said I'd seek advice.

She's 15 and has bisexual feelings. She hasn't told her parents because they say homophobic things and would fall out her. She has been seeing a 17 year old girl and this girl has just admitted to having feelings of confusion and feels she is transgender. The 15 year old wants to learn about this issue so she can support her girlfriend.

I've emailed our school Counselor but I've just learned that she is on secondment. I looked at Stonewalls website and it seemed really heavy for a 15 yr old. Does anyone here know of any material that could be suitable?

To be honest, in this day of internet savvy-ness, I don't know why she hasn't already researched it. It crossed my mind fleetingly that she was trying to get my opinion but I'm staying away from that one. I just want to try and get hold of some simple, non-biased and honest literature to explain to teenagers about this minefield issue.

OP posts:
M0stlyBowlingHedgehog · 01/05/2017 17:59

This is the pdf information leaflet on "bottom surgery" for transmen produced by GIRES, an organisation of trans people and the surgeons who support their transitions. So it's basically "on the side of uncritical transition", but as a gender critical feminist, I read the sections on loss of sexual sensation and possible side-effects and just think "why the fuck would anyone think doing this to their body was a good idea?"

I presume it must be driven by desperate levels of bodily dysphoria, but it's certainly "informed consent" - you know exactly what's going to be done to you. It might make an interesting read for your 15 year old friend.

Katnisnevergreen · 01/05/2017 17:08

Yetanother. I am not saying the op's teenager should see what is more persuasive, but only that she should be able to make up her own mind, regardless of the opinion of the OP or anyone else. I did not say that she should only see the 'TRA' as you put it side of things, how do you know I'm not advocating to only tear the ideas apart?

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 01/05/2017 16:05

Researching the side effects of puberty blockers and cross sex hormones on female bodies would be both helpful and, theoretically, neutral. The side effects are pretty horrific. I saw theoretical because TRAs like to ignore the side effects or lie about them.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 01/05/2017 15:54

All I can suggest is that your advice/suggested reading is fair and balanced. Please do not just give one side of the story. She deserves to be able to make up her own mind and support her gf in the best way possible

Mmmm. In the current climate being able to see beyond the accusations of terfdom and phobia put out by the TRA mob takes a great amount of self-confience and critical thinking skills though. I don't think it is simply a case of weighing up A and B because A has so much more force, power and potential persuasion than B, as well as being politically correct and not being averse to playing dirty pool.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 01/05/2017 15:51

Maybe also providing positive lesbian role moels would help in case she was starting from a point of self-hatred bcause she is same-sex attracted?

WelshMoth · 01/05/2017 15:47

All I can suggest is that your advice/suggested reading is fair and balanced. Please do not just give one side of the story. She deserves to be able to make up her own mind and support her gf in the best way possible.

I totally agree, Kat. I'm desperate to do the right thing here.

OP posts:
Prawnofthepatriarchy · 01/05/2017 14:41

Youth Transcritical Professionals is good for the nuts and bolts of what's wrong with the current medical approach.

Purple Sage is a gender critical lesbian blog. The vogue for transgender teens appears to be doing more harm to girls than boys, partly because there are more of them, partly because cross sex hormones do more physical damage to girls and, probably most importantly, because the lesbian community is seeing so many young lesbians lost to a way of life fuelled by internalized misogyny and homophobia. There are plenty of gay role models. Where are the lesbian role models?

VestalVirgin · 01/05/2017 14:32

4thwavenow is good from a gender critical standpoint but if shes looking to support her girlfriend..maybe not. Though it could be useful for the 'support' to be convincing her NOT to go down the hormones etc route. But that support could push her away.

Possibly. But in the end, how likely is it that a lesbian relationship survives one of them starting hormones and surgery to look like a man?
(And not only could the one who is not transitioning cease being attracted to the transitioning one, there's reason to assume that testosterone can turn lesbians straight, which would mean the transitioner might not be attracted to her girlfriend anymore.)

There's a high chance of that relationship breaking apart if the 15 year old supports the hormones and surgery route.

WankingMonkey · 01/05/2017 13:59

I would stay away from mermaids and stonewall tbh. Stonewall would likely end up convincing the 15 year old that she is trans too..given their definition of trans includes every person I know Hmm

4thwavenow is good from a gender critical standpoint but if shes looking to support her girlfriend..maybe not. Though it could be useful for the 'support' to be convincing her NOT to go down the hormones etc route. But that support could push her away.

Tavistock centre is probably good advice. They seem to be the most neutral of all. Not sure if they would just give advice to someone with a questioning partner though, rather than assess the partner themselves?

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 01/05/2017 10:14

Mermaids is an organization to steer well clear of. They put on videos of cool smiling teens but their agenda is irresponsible and homophobic.

BigDeskBob · 30/04/2017 23:19

It might be worth contacting the tavistock centre? I don't know what their website is like but it might be more neutral than other sources.

Katnisnevergreen · 30/04/2017 22:23

All I can suggest is that your advice/suggested reading is fair and balanced. Please do not just give one side of the story. She deserves to be able to make up her own mind and support her gf in the best way possible.

Some of the 4th wave reading is massively negative towards this issue. Equally, some of the pro media is massively one sided and skewed.

As a teacher, I would feel it my duty and obligation to allow her to find her own way. I realise you have not said your relationship but this is my professional opinion.

WelshMoth · 30/04/2017 22:19

Thanks Vestal - it's a good place for me to start. I think, because I'm in a position of trust here, I'll run everything by the School pastoral team. I'm uncomfortable with providing info that parents may kick-off (rightly or wrongly) about. That's said, our school has employed a TRA (I won't go into more detail but I know that as a fact) and I don't want them to be alerted and give them any reason to speak to this child.

Argh this is so difficult!

OP posts:
VestalVirgin · 30/04/2017 20:03

The only resources I know of are blogs ... the 4thwavenow blog is a place for parents, but since she's in the position that someone she knows and loves identifies as transgender, perhaps that's a good place to start.

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