Walking a woman home

IAmAmy - I was telling you not be so patronising, every women has suffered street harassment and I work in an area where I deal with the consequences. I hope you never know the things I know. The was to take the string out of the implied rebuke.

In my opinion you just cannot compare what girls experience purely for being female to boys' experiences

"boys experiences" are not just one thing. They are many and varied.

Just a few of those which have even made any news from the last couple of months alone, misogynist hate crimes:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-38584264

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/03/02/groom-admits-raping-stranger-hours-marrying-pregnant-partner/

www.itv.com/news/anglia/update/2017-02-28/police-outraged-by-rape-attack-in-ipswich/

I think that you used when talking about street harassment is pretty inappropriate. As for me "lumping all men together", I can't see where I've done that. In my first post on this thread I said "most men who walk women home are doing it to be thoughtful". This topic makes me very angry because of how much I know girls suffer from male violence, what it does, how it's targeted at us purely for being female and I find it frustrating to see anyone claim it's worse for men.

Men were nearly twice as likely as women (3.8% compared with 2.1%) to have experienced one or more violent crimes in the year prior to interview. The figures also showed that single people had the highest chance of being a victim (6.6%)

www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2013/feb/07/crime-statistics-england-wales-violent-sexual-offences

It has some interesting facts on domestic and sexual violence as well.

Clearly IAmAmy none of the behaviour you mention has ever happened to me. Yes I am aware of it.

This thread is about men walking women home. Men are more likely to be attacked, killed, mugged than women.

You lump all men together. Men are victims of male violence too and suffer in silence mostly. This pain is not better or worse than what women suffer, but it is real and it should not be dismissed.

Women are allowed to be traumatised

Oh my. Have you seen the victim blaming, rape jokes, constant sneering at girls and women who speak out about what's happened, excusing of male behaviour which goes on? Even boys of my age do it no end. In my opinion you just cannot compare what girls experience purely for being female to boys' experiences. What it feels like to be in school uniform and commented on by a grown man following you, to be walking to a friend's house and shouted at by two boys in their late teens who then call you a "miserable bitch" for ignoring them as you're intimidated, the list is endless.

Comforted obvs - although contorted may be more interesting.

My point IAmAmy is that he hadn't really pulled himself together. Women are allowed to be traumatised and are contorted by their friends - mostly. Boys have to put on a big front compounding the misery.

Also, as I mention a lot, I work with troubled teenagers so am more than aware of the issues faced by both sexes.

It's not a competition. Men also suffer from male violence.

"..With regards to males being more at risk, I doubt they are of serious violence or just the street harassment which is regular and intimidating for most girls and women I know of..."

Last I checked, almost twice as many men are victims of violence than women. I don't know how you're defining "serious", but that is a pretty significant difference in the statistical risk.

I wish I could just pull myself together knowing some things which have happened to girls I know.

I know very few teenage boys who've been mugged. Every teenage girl I know has been harassed on the street regularly, my first instance was 14 in school uniform. It's horrific, intimidating, degrading. I know girls who've been sexually assaulted by teenage boys too. When teenage boys experience violence it's abhorrent but it just doesn't come close to what girls face.

IAmAmy dismissing the violence most boys face is no better than dismissing the violence women face.

I know many, many teenage boys who have been mugged. The majority of these boys are very distressed and upset, they may put up a front but most are genuinely traumatised. I had a boy crying about his friend who was mugged a fortnight ago. Sobbing. He then pulled himself together went on his way joking with his friends.

We need to teach young women to be street aware and how to defend themselves NOT that they need a man.

Doyoumind

Why should he "of course" walk her home?
What is it that compels this?
Who then walks him home?

This issue really gets to me. Whilst most boys or men who walk girls or women home are doing so to be thoughtful, it annoys me that it's due to the risk of male violence and in a way is a way all men benefit from male violence even if they'd hate to think of it that way - some get to look nice and caring for walking a woman home, even though they only feel they need to do so or women only feel safer when they do so due to the fear of male violence.

As for girls/women all walking home in a group, who walks the last one left home?

With regards to males being more at risk, I doubt they are of serious violence or just the street harassment which is regular and intimidating for most girls and women I know of.

When i was doing the walking home thing,it was more about spending extra time together/we're going the same way rather than safety.

It reinforces the view that, when the threat is violence from a stranger, there is safety in numbers. And that if someone has to walk alone, it should be the biggest/strongest who is fastest to run away or most able to withstand attack generally.

These are biological differences.

But when it's your own DS who is mugged, it's no easier than if it was your DD.

So it sounds like they are both being sensible and well prepared, group situations are covered. So really it comes down to what happens when it's just the two of them. My first thought would be that it should come down to logistics. The one nearest wherever they are is accompanied home by the other one, who then has to complete their leg of the journey alone, taking sensible precautions and confirming by phone/text when they are safely home. I don't see why it should automatically be your daughter who is always accompanied, involving some doubling back for the boy presumably? But that's easy for me to say, and I don't have daughters.

My POV as a feminist is that it's unnecessary and perpetuates the idea of women being weaker/more vulnerable. I personally always refuse it and have always seen myself home from leaving home at 17, and before, where necessary and have never had any issues (luck involved, of course). I do think though that in current times, I will be encouraging my sons not to walk around alone at night, so maybe we should be saying that everyone should ideally be going about in groups or pairs, irrespective of sex?

I think the problem I have with it, as a feminist, is the number of women I know now in their thirties or forties who are too scared to get in a cab on their own. So sometimes we have to arrange things to cost more so that certain women are dropped, to their door, by other women and never left last in the cab etc. As far as I know (and they say) this is all about perceived risk, not as a result of any previous bad experience. Often the husband's are made to wait at the door. I find this a bit pathetic in grown women, if I'm honest, but I accept that I have been lucky to never have had any issues in cabs or getting home. Its a tough one, for sure.

Isn't the proportion of men attacked by strangers also higher because it includes men who have got into fights, e.g. football hooliganism etc? I have relatives for whom a fight on a Saturday night down the pub was a fairly common occurrence....

Yes it does reinforce the view that men "look after" women.

Consideration should be given to both of their safety.

What would DD have done prior to this relationship?

Are there other ways she could get home safely? Driving herself? Cycling herself? Taxi? Other friends who lives near her (only if they're out in a group obviously)
If i was your friend I'd chat to her DD about how to get home safely without being completely reliant on a male to walk her. But in your position I would support your DS in offering to walk her back too.
More men are attacked by strangers than women but there are many times more men walking around in their own - so the risk per person is possibly higher for women, and the risk of sexual violence or hassle definitely higher. A friend's son was mugged for his phone and wallet on the way back from walking GF home though so neither option are risk free sadly. I imagine his GF may have felt pretty guilty about that.

Stats may show that more women are attacked in the home, by men they know but in this case it's more relevant to compare the stats of women who are attacked while walking alone v walking with company. I suggest she's safer in being accompanied by her boyfriend. And anyway, if she were to walk home alone and "something happened" we all know the victim blaming would centre on her daring to walk alone while female.

It's a bit complicated because: you can say he's statistically more likely to suffer violence than she is, but i dare say those reports dont take into account the amount of times women are followed, intimidated and otherwise harrassed. But, she's just as likeky to endure that in the day as in the night.

Either way, I'm a mean nasty feminist but given the choice of walking home alone or walking with a man, I'd choose the latter every time. Not because I'm a weak incapable woman but because it reduces the probability of male intimidation and violence from about 85% to 5%

My DM was equally concerned for my brother and I as teens (since young men are more likely to be mugged or attacked) and until we moved out encouraged us both to drive, or (for boozy use reputable taxis (which she paid for). After moving out I wouldn't expect a bf to escort me home unless he lived very near by.