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Original poster

How should trans individuals be included in competitive sport?

88 replies

Quodlibet · 27/02/2017 17:20

I wonder if this has been debated already?

www.washingtonpost.com/sports/highschools/meet-the-texas-wrestler-who-won-a-girls-state-title-his-name-is-mack/2017/02/25/982bd61c-fb6f-11e6-be05-1a3817ac21a5_story.html

It's a really complex issue clearly, as no one would wish to discourage trans individuals from playing sport.

But as I can see it, if trans individuals are included in mainstream sports competition, girls/women are disadvantaged whichever way the call goes in terms of whether trans individuals are included with their birth gender or the gender they identify with.

If the former, then FTM competitors with a newly gained strength/speed advantage beat F competitors, as in this example in the US.

If the latter, then MtF trans competitors beat F competitors with their residual/inherent speed/strength advantage.

What is the answer? The only one I can think of is that competitors with modified bodies are not able to compete with non-modified competitors (the same way as Oscar Pistorius was not allowed to compete in mainstream men's events as his blades actually could have given him an advantage.) I envisage that there would be resistance to this from some in the trans community as it could be interpreted as excluding trans individuals from sports events. But I can't see how else women's sport doesn't end up massively compromised.

OP posts:
Datun · 27/02/2017 18:18

The woman that won that wrestling match was transitioning to male and was taking testosterone. It was only allowed because there is exemption for 'medical reasons'. It was unfair on the female competitors because testosterone gave her a greater advantage.

I would be very interested to see whether she starts winning against natal born men, once her transition is complete.

In Iran, where homosexuality is illegal and there are there quite a few transwomen who would ordinarily just be gay men, at least half the women's football team is made up of transwomen.

And yes, I agree there should be a third category. How they divide that up into where they are on their transition and what drugs they have taken would be for them to decide.

Personally, I would get right behind it, but I don't think it is something that the trans community wants.

FriendlyPolecat · 27/02/2017 18:16

Caster Semenya has an advantage and isn't trans but has been allowed to compete against other females anyway. I thought it was a wrong decision but, whatever

Evergreen777 · 27/02/2017 18:04

Don't they have quite strict rules already, linked to chromosomes (so you must be XX to compete in women's events)? And I presume hormones that a male to female trans would take would be on the banned list already.

I read about some cases where women athletes had been disqualified because they failed a sex test - turned out they were some form of intersex. Not as rare as you might think among top women athletes because of the physical advantages of male attributes. I don't think the women concerned that I read about were cheats, as far as anyone knew - I think they'd been unaware of being intersex until tested. But basically if they can't compete as women I would assume trans people can't either.

I'd guess that amateur teams can make their own minds up, and some sports don't discriminate between men and women so they can still do sport if they want

BevGoldbergsSister · 27/02/2017 18:02

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

glenthebattleostrich · 27/02/2017 17:58

I'm going to sound arsey here but heyho.

How about trans people solve the problems. How about we just say no to them. They can't compete against their new (or old) gender so if they want to compete they can come up with a solution. But that solution isn't women move over.

sleepyhead · 27/02/2017 17:56

FTM should be able to compete in women's classes as long as they abide by the same doping regulations.

PatMullins · 27/02/2017 17:55

Yes but a weight lifter wouldn't get far as a gymnast and vice versa

Thefitfatty · 27/02/2017 17:53

vestalvirgin massive amounts of athletes fall in the obese to underweight categories. Look at the BMI's of weight lifters to gymnasts.

picklemepopcorn · 27/02/2017 17:50

Typed my ideas out about three times, but can't make it make sense! Will wait for wiser people.

OhTallulah · 27/02/2017 17:49

I don't think they should unless it's in their own category.
No point young women competing if this is going to happen.

VestalVirgin · 27/02/2017 17:44

I don't really see a need to include trans individuals in sports. We don't include overweight people or people with anorexia in competitive sports, either.

As a person who was born with a body that is not, technically, disabled, but inherently unsuitable for sports, I do not really think it is a fate worse than death to never be able to compete professionally.

I can deal with it, and so can trans.

MrsCaecilius · 27/02/2017 17:43

Place holding. Been wondering about this thorny topic!

AndShesGone · 27/02/2017 17:35

I think the only option is a third category so that trans people don't overtake the women's event

Maybe I'm wrong but I thought that MtF could compete in men's events but weren't as good as the men so the only reason they were successful was if they joined women's events ?

Are there any trans sportspeople taking part in their original biological sex category and being successful? If so then they ought to still be able to. The rules don't preclude them do they ?