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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Can you help me make sense of why this conversation annoyed me?

59 replies

Mrstumbletap · 26/02/2017 16:26

So I'm a teacher and I am lucky to teach sixth form students too, they are awesome and come back with real questions about rape, about same sex marriage, about wearing revealing clothing, equal pay etc and want to know more, they challenge me and I challenge them back and I can literally see their minds unfolding in front of me, it's fantastic.

Anyway I am currently training a teacher too and he often observes my lessons and contributes. On Friday the students were talking about job roles and the trainee teacher I will call him 'Gary' said "yeah but some roles are better for men, they are stronger, not all roles should be given to all people". He used army/infantry roles as an example. I challenged this but he stuck to his guns and said some things that involve strength are just better for men.

Then later the class were talking about the footage of a trump supporter being interviewed saying "women shouldn't rule a country they could start wars too easily" the reporter replies "but aren't all wars started by men?" Gary then chips in and says "No Helen of Troy started a war!"

I was then showing the students a link I found on social media called "women at the top" (don't know if you have seen it) and it shows images of The Houses of Parliament, the EU, White House meetings etc with loads of people and then another image with all the men removed using photoshop, showing there are only 1 or 2 women in these important meetings. The strap line is 'There is room for more women at the top'. Gary then says "I have no problem with the women being in these positions as long as they are qualified". But he isn't questioning the qualifications of the men in these positions?!

It has bugged me all weekend, am I over thinking this or is his challenging of these examples justified?

OP posts:
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Anniegetyourgun · 05/03/2017 08:36

... and Argentina, if I remember rightly without even Googling, was led by General Galtieri who was, by all accounts, A Man. Unlike Gary, I was actually of voting age at the time. We may also point out that whatever Mrs T's warmongering tendencies may have been, she was Prime Minister, not dictator, and could not have dragged the country to war if a whole bunch of men hadn't voted in support.

Cheated, checked Google. Galtieri it was. Go me.

IAmAmy · 04/03/2017 01:51

If he taught at my school we'd tear him to pieces.

IAmAmy · 04/03/2017 01:50

Because he's a dickhead

HelenDenver · 28/02/2017 19:48

"As Gary can't distinguish between history and mythology and Gary is quite clearly a galloping sexist, "

Sing it, sister!

elQuintoConyo · 27/02/2017 14:28

Jeez! Just reading the OP I was slapping my phone! Gary - you're a wazzock of the highest order!

NeverEverAnythingEver · 27/02/2017 13:42

Wow! That Gary doesn't sound like he's teacher material!

OP Can you just tell him to STFU during your lesson? It seems that he's just derailing everything.

"If he is 33 he was 6 when she resigned." Grin So how old is Gary?

whoputthecatout · 27/02/2017 11:16

Actually, Thatcher is a bad example of a woman 'starting' a war. The war was started when Argentina invaded the Falklands on 2 April 1982. No invasion = no war.

Your teacher friend will have to choose again after citing a myth and an historical inaccuracy.

Wouldn't want him within a country mile of teaching any child.

Somerville · 27/02/2017 10:19

He brought up a mythological figure to counter a point about a political/historical issue? Confused

I think his stupidity is almost as offensive as his misogyny.

Pulling him up on that point, and how it could confuse pupils, might feel rather satisfying.

Penhacked · 27/02/2017 10:09

I would make it clear that his job is to be objective. As tempting as it is to belittle him, you would be doing his future students a massive favour to mentor him in cultivating a dispassionate, neutral stance and make him aware of his own bias by pointing these examples out as opinions.

IvankaTrudeau · 27/02/2017 09:02

This is immature and maybe a bit unprofessiona, but is there anyway you can somehow show him up through discussion - kind of draw him out into saying something more stupid than he already has, that even the students can see that so he looks ridiculous/they can see how unreasonable/sexist he is sounding and either laugh at him/dismiss him. Maybe going too far but would be very satisfying!

Otherwise just keep plugging away at it, or mention to someone that he is often chipping in inappropriately.

deydododatdodontdeydo · 27/02/2017 08:36

Even if Helen of Troy did start a war (Thatcher would have been a much better example, though), how does that make any sense?
"Men start all wars - no, one woman once started a war".
Well, done, he's found one counter example in the last 3000 years.
He sounds like a dick, though, and will wriggle to find anyway of justifying his beliefs.

YorkshireTree · 27/02/2017 07:37

Gary is an enormoknob. Let us know how the chat goes.

Lessthanaballpark · 26/02/2017 22:21

Gary is your intellectual servant OP. He will probably go far.

noblegiraffe · 26/02/2017 22:13

Dickish smart-alec (and incorrect but in a way that would take ages to go into and derail a discussion) comments are annoying enough when they come from the kids. When they come from a colleague it must be bloody infuriating.

Cheekyandfreaky · 26/02/2017 22:06

Op I sympathise- it's so difficult as you are trying to model good adult behaviour to young people and when someone blurts out crap in front of a group what can you do? I am sure your 6th formers have noticed- students who are learning all day are way sharper than most adults. I would say as frustrating as it is I wouldn't engage his nonsense in front of the students- I am sure from your posts you wouldn't, but it sounds like he wants a reaction.

Mrstumbletap · 26/02/2017 21:56

Clearly some of his examples are flawed, Maggie Thatcher and Helen of Troy! He is so certain, so sure when he is talking about his opinions it's only when I pick it apart afterwards I think that isn't right?!

It wasn't even an observation it was exactly that same situation as you mentioned cheekyandfreaky it was just a free of his that he wondered in and volunteered his thoughts on the topic we were discussing.

He basically mansplained feminism to my class as I wasn't doing it right, clearly.

OP posts:
LassWiTheDelicateAir · 26/02/2017 21:46

"I grew up with Maggie Thatcher as Priminister,"

If he is 33 he was 6 when she resigned.

Penhacked · 26/02/2017 21:40

Next assignment. "Donald Trump would not be where he is today if he had been a female". Discuss. Start with Gary and watch the ignorant sexist fucker sweat.

wishcarry · 26/02/2017 21:38

He is a bit of a dick really.
I worked in a male dominated role,and I could easily move around a sheet of plasterboard or a fire door on my own whereas a couple of the men I worked with couldn't.

RufusTheSpartacusReindeer · 26/02/2017 21:35

Fine thanks miss

Went out for dinner with work tonight so that was nice

Hope everything is well in your world

Cheekyandfreaky · 26/02/2017 21:33

Gary is behaving like a student- as a teacher (I realise he is not yet but) he should not be offering opinions like this, he is supposed to be acting in loco parentis and I would guess not all of those students parents would share this view. In short he should keep quiet.

I found this situation very similar to one I am in- I teach and there is someone who I am friendly with in my school who I have helped to make a successful pgce application. Her role in schools means that sometimes she is free and has recently taken in upon herself to wander into my classroom and tell me in front of students how I should be teaching. I wouldn't mind if she came to me one-to-one but I find her approach undermining. Also, and this is where I sound mean, her subject knowledge is weak and sometimes she has wandered in and given incorrect answers to students which I have to hastily correct. She is leaving at the end of this year and i do want to stay friendly with her as otherwise she is lovely. Sorry to hijack your thread but I may follow similar advice from pps as I am getting a bit peed off.

Missswatch · 26/02/2017 21:30

As for Gary. This one is for you

Missswatch · 26/02/2017 21:28

Hi rufus. How you been? Hope everything is ok where you are

RufusTheSpartacusReindeer · 26/02/2017 21:22

Oooh gary has turned up Grin

Hey misswatch i know its you really

RufusTheSpartacusReindeer · 26/02/2017 21:20

You sound awesome

He sounds like a twat

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