"Chestfeeding"

ghostly

That link made me so furious!

Once I calmed down I realised that some bright little spark has cunningly put together all the ridiculous language-mangling demands and dropped them into one online article. I'm assuming it's purposely designed to shock.

MSM picking up on changing 'expectant mothers' to 'expectant people' is going to hit a lot of women slap in the face. Being called a mother is many women's dream. There is an extraordinarily emotional pull to it.

I can't see many women putting up with this.

And now doctors are being told don't call pregnant patients 'mothers' over fears it might upset transgender people
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4167632/Don-t-call-pregnant-patients-mothers.html
I can't quite believe it could be true - it is the Dail Mail after all. I really hope it's not true

LA LECHE LEAGUE, ffs.

It's breastfeeding because it's done with the breasts. Transmen have breasts. Because they're biological women. Never mind if a man has breast tissue. Men don't feed babies.

I have a chest but my breasts are attatched to it.
Men also have breast tissue in their man boobs and can get breast cancer,
So it's still breast feeding from a breast?

Absolutely!

May be it's just me but I think there's something vaguely nauseating about the word "chestfeeding"

It makes me think of something out of a horror story - something parasitic feeding on the chests of animals. It's really offensive.

I've spent years breastfeeding. Dealing with mastitis, cracked nipped, blisters, thrush.
I'll call it what I damned well like!
I got would up with this earlier when I saw an article about LLL in Canada. They've got "chestfeeding" on their literature now and have a trans man as a breastfeeding consultant!

The bloody absolute cheek of it.

When you consider all the emotion around breastfeeding that is already there: the harassment and obstacles women get when they try and do it; the endless bloody jokes about "bitty" and pitting mothers against each other; the feelings of failure and guilt that so many women are left with when breastfeeding fails for them; and then these monstrous egotists come in and demand that women make it All.About.Them.

When will it end?

It was an interesting exercise to introduce the issue into a generally depoliticised space. The issue has been aired more in the UK so people are generally unaware of it now, except to know that they should try hard to not be prejudiced towards trans people.

Lots of women will have been very surprised at the heavy handed accusations. I did defend myself politely and logically, to which the accuser responded illogically by denying they wanted to shut the debate down. When asked to educate us, she did mention she was trying to get over her own dysphoria, and that she had thought this was a safe space and I (and others) had made her feel unsafe. So the same, typical arguments. I said this was a women's issue not a trans issue so please tell us how we can discuss it here, using the correct language? Then I got the blah about the emotional intelligence. I said I felt upset about the accusations and did get women supporting and defend
ing me.

Yes Jiggly it's very clear that using logic leads to being screamed at.

Overall a constructive experience.

This is how it works though Nappies. If you question using the tools of logic etc then you get screamed at for being transphobic and the person claims it's literal violence and flounces off.

And then you're a big fat bully who is unkind to 'the most vulnerable people in our society'

IWantATardis

Course. It's all ridiculous, special snowflakery bollocks. Sorry, gender neutral, round hairy things

It's not like the transmen in the OP's link are using a different part of their bodies for feeding.
They're not earfeeding or toe feeding, their using their (male) breasts

I'm annoyed at how it's okay to be misogynistic by telling women they shouldn't call breastfeeding breastfeeding as it [gasp] has that womanly word BREASTS in it - but it's transphobic for a woman to dare to suggest that renaming breastfeeding (because transmen don't like to be reminded that they've got breasts) is perhaps a little OTT.

It's also worth noting that since massive amounts of the ideology simply do not stand up to scrutiny, that if you do manage to engage, there is often no proper argument used as a comeback.

So you using the word 'minority' was called a hate crime. It's worth innocently asking why? After a bit of outrage along the lines of 'you don't know what it's like to be trans, all the suffering' etc you'll often find there is actually no counter argument at all. Just cries of transphobia and bigot. Again, asking why often produces the answer you just ARE.

Remaining polite, logical and succinct without losing your temper (!), particularly if you can back up what you are saying with links, often exposes the no platforming for what it is.

It's really irritating and not a little scary how you have to pussyfoot around this issue, wrap it in cotton wool, and sprinkle it with smarties in order to make a point.

Many people are in complete ignorance, (and not a little denial), when it comes to the trans issue. When you read about it you tend to 'fast forward' to all the logical implications. It's a fairly swift connection of the dots.

So if you make assumptions about people's knowledge, you sometimes forget that they have no background in the way that you do.

It sounds as though you have given people food for thought nappies. If the drip feeding of information pricks people's interest then it's all to the good.

It's hard to get people to understand without alienating them, but it sounds as though you may have done just that with at least some people.

Datun I'm not that clued up or articulate on the topic but definitely think that it's something that women, and mothers/parents need to be aware of. I was interested to see how my community would react when exposed to some of the more extremist notions of trans ideology.

So I posted (took out, on reflection, the last bit about men and breasts) and there were a few posts of puzzlement from other women. Then someone accused us all of transphobia, absolutely lambasted us, and demanded to admin that the thread be deleted and we all get a talking to.

I and the others protested that we hadn't been transphobic, just wanted to talk about how this proposal affected women. Apparently describing a group as a minority is a hate speech

I tried to question her but we weren't on the same page. I need to have emotional intelligence before I post, she said. There were a few women who thought it would be nice to change the language to be more inclusive, how we need to move with the times and how ideas and language evolve as we become more trans inclusive as a society. But by and large the reaction was incredulous.

It was a good discussion. Admin warned the accuser to be polite (she also mocked someone's spelling) but then I agreed to have comments shut off.

Nappies

Sounds logical and articulate to me. Doesn't come across as raging bigotry!

I'd be interested in the response.

Been waiting for an opportunity to post something about trans issues on my local fb mums group, to stimulate debate. This link is perfect. I hope I have the right tone of bewilderment in my post:

I've been trying to wrap my head around this idea. I know that for women who feel dysphoric about their body, and would rather identify as men, it's a distressing situation, and they should be supported and not face prejudice.

However I struggle to understand why the millions of women around the world who use the term breastfeeding as a basic description should change to chestfeeding, because of a tiny minority who feel that it makes them uncomfortable?

Men have breast tissue too - in fact they can get breast cancer. So breasts are actually a biological reality for men. Therefore it's a stereotype that men don't have breasts.

So I am perplexed about this. Essentially, women are being asked to stop using the term 'breasts' because of a stereotype (that only women have them).

Has anyone come across this before? As an aside, I also wonder if transgender women who grow breasts from hormones or have implants call them 'breasts'? In which case, are the only people who should call them breasts men who transition to become women?

Yeah they can fuck off with chest feeding.

Oh for fuck sake

The phenomenon of females who call themselves men, claim to have gender dyshporia do themselves no service in these manoeuvres, much less getting pregnant. The definition of dysphoria includes the replusion of the body in its biological functions--for a female that would include menstruation, bloating, breasts, pregnancy, and breast feeding.

I am even more concerned that the NHS is funding what would seem to be elective surgery. You either do or do not have dysphoria. All the rest is bullshit.

Why do men have nipples? Why do male mammals have nipples? Breast tissue is synonymous with being a mammal, regardless of biological sex at birth. The only reason why women develop breasts is because of hormonal release during puberty and this differs widely and hugely amongst all women. Men also develop the breast tissue (and their nipples darken and widen).

The chest is upper abdominal and includes organs such as the heart, lungs and diaphragm.

Oh FFS.

I am breastfeeding DS3. I refuse to call this chestfeeding.
The breastmilk (and I'm not going to call that chestmilk either) is being produced by mammary glands in my breast tissue. It's not magically appearing from some unisex part of my chest wall.

And as pp point out, breast tissue is something that men also have around there nipples, even if they can't lactate. Breast cancer is something that men - biological men - can develop. Unless we're going to be redefining breast cancer too in this new post-fact world

And if we're talking about someone who genuinely believes themselves to be a man voluntarily getting pregnant, giving birth and choosing to breastfeed rather than bottle feed - how is using the term "breastfeeding" more triggering to them and more disruptive to their view of their sex than actually carrying a baby inside their womb for 9 months?