Uncomfortable feelings about the teaching of "consent"

I'm sorry you feel shame and guilt about how violent your sex is.

Now what are you going to do to stop it?

I'm not 'demonising' anyone, I'm stating a fact

You are stating a fact that is pointlessly abstract and by your own admission, a fact everyone already knows. It serves no useful purpose other than to try and guilt or shame men into feeling that they are responsible for something that they are not.

I care about them both, I don't think I've said I care more about one or the other. I care about them in different ways for different reasons. I'd like a reduction in all male violence tbh.

I care about male violence against men just about as much as you care about male violence against women growapear :)

I think on some level I maybe do care more about violence against women purely on the grounds that it is more deep rooted, and more likely to be written off as a fuss about nothing.

If a man is assaulted and reports it, he is generally going to be taken seriously. If a women is groped and manhandled, even in public and in front of witnesses, it will often be dismissed as a misunderstanding. I think that is fairly worrying. And the assumption seems to be that women lie, until proven otherwise.

This is a thread about sexual violence against women on a feminist board. Therefore I'm talking about violence against women.

I'm not 'demonising' anyone, I'm stating a fact. Men can accept that fact and do something about it, or use their hurt feelings as an excuse to do nothing. You seem to favour the hurt feelings, do nothing route.

I didn't say I didn't think male violence was a problem or an issue. I have a daughter so of course I worry about her. I also have a son. I don't worry less about him because he is a boy.

But enough about me. Why do you speak care more about violence against women than you do about violence against boys/other men ? You didn't answer.

So because most of the women you know haven't said to you that they have experienced male violence and asked you to help them, you don't think there's a problem?

You've said it doesn't happen because you haven't directly observed it

No i didn't. I said most to the women I knew did not appear to be in any need of help or aid from me.

And you think that demonising all men is likely to make men inclined to care more about the harm other men do to women rather than the harm they do to each other ?

Caring at all would be a start. You've said it doesn't happen because you haven't directly observed it.

I'm in a professional well paid job. I've no doubt I appear fine to colleagues and acquaintances. I've still been a victim of domestic violence, rape and sexual assault and countless instances of sexual harassment.

For the same reason that people generally worry more about children being assaulted by adults, than about adults assaulting adults. Because there is an imbalance of power, and in most situations a woman is weaker and smaller than a man, therefore the potential for harm is greater.

Who said you had to care more? You don't seem to care at all.

Why would I care more about women being assaulted than men ? Why do you care more about women being assaulted then men ?

'How else is one supposed to form an opinion about the best use of their resources and time if not that which they directly observe ?'

How about engaging with the news every now and again?

So you only accept what you can directly observe? Does this apply to all aspects of your life and decision making?

How else is one supposed to form an opinion about the best use of their resources and time if not that which they directly observe ? Just blindly do what someone on an internet forum tells them ? As you are no doubt aware feminist analysis is not terribly popular at the moment, this however does not appear to have caused you to doubt in any way I can see the veracity it all.

'If I felt that men were a massive threat to women, and believed that the plight of women in our society were a massive issue then I would be inclined to do just that. Most of the women I know are in well paid professional jobs and are doing pretty well, they would acknowledge this themselves and don't apparently go around wishing they had been born men because men have it so much better than they do.'

Wow.

So you don't feel the fact that 85,000+ women are raped in the UK every year is a massive issue? What is it then?

So if I understand you correctly you aren't concerned at all about male violence towards women and so you don't do any of the things I mentioned to support that cause. This is based on the fact that the women you know don't appear to you to have had any issues.

Sparrow

I said that if you really felt the danger all men pose to women was as grave as you seem to think it is, then it would be sensible to advise women to avoid entering relationships with men. You actually kind of agreed with this as you expressed your amazement that women have relationships with men at all. At no time have I ever suggested any victim of violence has ever caused or is to blame for it, so really not sure where you get that idea from. If on the other hand i spent my spare time telling people how dangerous an activity was (in this case apparently being near any men) then again i ask what use that information ? The point being it isn't information - it is intended to shame and demonise all men.

Speak

If I felt that men were a massive threat to women, and believed that the plight of women in our society were a massive issue then I would be inclined to do just that. Most of the women I know are in well paid professional jobs and are doing pretty well, they would acknowledge this themselves and don't apparently go around wishing they had been born men because men have it so much better than they do.

As it happens I do give a lot of my money to charity and I spend my spare time helping organisations that I think need help. I manage to do this without demonising half the population and telling them they ought to be ashamed of themselves for not doing more.

I have no intention of telling growapear what he can do. He's not as stupid as he makes himself out to be here, he knows full well there are hundreds of things he could do. But they all involve effort/inconvenience for him so he doesn't want to do them. He'd rather just say there's no point in even talking about it. It's as simple as that. In an earlier post he reckoned I should be giving women information about how to stay safe. Because of course, as a woman, I should be doing the work of informing women about the work they need to do to prevent violence. Because men shouldn't be expected to do any work, ever.

It also makes me wonder if men like growapear actually believe that women are to blame for male violence, as in, women cause it so women should prevent it?

Well said, speak.