Transgender Documentary on BBC2 Thursday 2100 "Transgender Kids: Who Knows best?"

In that Huff Post article, the author describes the transing of children as "a child centric affirmative approach to children who are questioning their gender identity or who are sure they are transgender."

Seems to me that what this approach is affirmative of is trans ideology and it is trans centric. Fuck the kids, this isn't about them - it's about trans obsession with "passing" and about bolstering their insistence of a "born that way" narrative.

Gender dysphoric does not equal transgender.

That's the key, isn't it?

Who's got a long enough ladder to graffiti that on two dozen motorway bridges?

It's a very good one if so. Sadly I fear not.

Hahaha, is that a parody?

m.huffpost.com/uk/entry/14146168

I don't understand this article. Very strange

Thanks for that article ItsAll. Very interesting and very telling.

Exactly.
Allowing children to go through normative puberty weeds out the 'not really trans' if you like. But blocking puberty guarantees that a child will continue to identity as trans. So blockers make it impossible for the notreally trans kids to desist. It's unbelievable logic.

Being trans isn't an innate condition. It's a set of actions and behaviours that people choose or have chosen for them if they are not old enough to consent.

WRT the children who desist, the trans position is ridiculous.

They say "oh but that just means that the children weren't trans is the first place" as though this somehow defends their position. It doesn't. It shows their "let's support all persistently gender dysphoric children by agreeing they are trans" to be irresponsible, unethical and motivated by an adult political agenda.

The WHOLE POINT of what people like Zucker and the parents he works with are doing is that MOST OF THE CHILDREN WERE NEVER TRANS. Gender dysphoric does not equal transgender. Which is why treating them as though they are is incredibly wrong and stupid. It is also denying them support and or help with what is really going on with them.

I think we need to think of transgenderism (at the very least for minors) not as something you are but as something you do. Transgenderism is not an identity or a state of being, it is a practice (healthy or otherwise). But of course by saying that I'm literally committing violence against transpeople and erasing their very existence.

Very interesting article Itsallgoing thanks for posting it.

I've often thought that referencing two spirit people was a bit of an own goal by the transactavists because regardless of whether these were homosexual's or 'true' trans people, not one of them transitioned in anyway other than socially, no hormones, no surgery and yet they were not killing themselves in droves because they had the wrong body.

Their sex dysphoria (if they actually experienced any at all) was alleviated, not by being regarded as actual women but by being allowed to take on gender roles that they preferred - sort of blows current transgender dogma out of the water.

"Don't they identify at trans in those places though? Rather than women? (And where's the transmen? Or did I just not notice?)"

I think that's part of the sexism. A man can be a woman in these places - and in fact they have more freedom than actual women do. But a woman has her place and that doesn't include doing 'man' things, like going around on her own, or being promiscuous. E.g., there was the recent case of the British banker who raped and murdered a Indonesian prostitute in Hong Kong - the Indonesians weren't interested in the case, the attitude was 'well she was a prostitute'.

Yes that's another worrying aspect ItsAllGoingToBeFine. I'd forgotten about that. Autistic children have spoken about feeling something about them wasn't right in some way, and latching onto trans as an answer.

Prawn, he's a psychotherapist.

I watched this this afternoon. It was far better than I expected. As a PP said, the makers gave the TRAs lots of time and let them hang themselves with it. Not surprised to hear Twitter is aflame. This documentary is damaging to TRAs because the impression the programme made, as the facts unfolded, was that Prof Zucker and those recommending caution were the only grown ups in the room.

What did that ghastly transman do? I missed it. I do hope he isn't an academic or a HCP.

roses The trans activists will say 'they even accept trans in India/Thailand/etc why not here?

Don't they identify at trans in those places though? Rather than women? (And where's the transmen? Or did I just not notice?)

I'd love to be able to see 20 years into the future to find out where all the trans stuff has gone. What will be the prevailing ideology then? How many of the under-25s who are calling themselves, or being identified by parents, as "trans" now will be living as the opposite sex, still be taking hormones, have had surgery? Will there be a huge amount of medical and surgical interventions to try and reverse the effects of "transing" treatments being doled out now? It did occur to me, watching the documentary last night, what a great money-spinner the whole trans industry must be - especially in the USA and other countries with no NHS. .

I think it'll be a mess, to be honest.

Some of the people who were transed but would have been happy as gay people will probably just stick with the surgicalized bits-added/bits-cut-off bodies that they now have, because trying to transition back is just too shaming/traumatizing, and because of the medical difficulties of actually transitioning back properly so who knows what your poor old body will look like in the end.

Some will transition back, at enormous psychological cost, and be angry and bitter about what has happened to them.

There will almost certainly be a lot fewer butch lesbians and femme-y gay men--which means probably somewhat fewer gay people in general. Not that this will represent a problem for GLAAD, Stonewall and all those organizations, since their focal interests and membership will be largely focused on "queer" people (trans of various types, heterosexual women who claim that they are "queer" because they are polyamorous or pansexual or pancake-sexual or .... ugh, who fucking cares....).

People who actually are gay will probably wind up splitting and forming their own organizations (amidst the usual death threats, rape threats, censorship attempts and so on).

People who have been transed and are now regretting it will sue in some cases. Some doctors may start getting more cautious, leading to more lawsuits from young people on the other side, who want to be transitioned.

Commentators will be writing articles on "The Great LBGT Split: Could it have been prevented?" and getting nostalgic for the good old 1990s when we were all in it together.

It seems like going back to medieval attitudes in many ways.

The trans activists will say 'they even accept trans in India/Thailand/etc why not here?' But the reality is that women are third-class citizens in these places.

I have spent time in Indonesia where gay men aren't much of a thing but they have a lot of (pre-op) transwomen, it's homophobia if anything - you don't see gay couples, but if you dress up as a woman it's somehow not gay so they turn a blind eye.

That's great to hear Manumission. Sense prevails!

I think he should consider suing all these twats for libel.

Admittedly I didn't know about Dr Zucker until yesterday but that Stonewall statement is totally misrepresenting his practice isn't it? I'm almost embarrassed by it. He was never advocating 'curing' trans people.

This is a very well written piece

alicedreger.com/gendermad

Mollie I don't know if this gives you any hope but my DD18 has performed a complete 180 on this subject and now speaks fluent "TERF". It was a long slow turning circle, mind you.

I was also a bit at the "we don't want parents to panic" line. Well unless they are panicking about their child committing suicide unless they unquestionably follow their assertions that they are in the wrong body - then, THEN parents definitely should panic.

There is so much flip flopping in their arguements that it becomes very hard not to see it as mass gaslighting.