Third wave feminism

I tried to explain why I don't understand so there is no need to be like that

I've explained several times that prostitute is a synonym for whore. I'm still confused as to which bit of that sentence you do not understand. If you break it down a bit further I will explain it to you.

Are you unfamiliar with the concept of a dictionary?

Not at all. However all of the words "trans exclusive radical feminist" are in the dictionary and that is a slur, radical feminists cannot have it both ways I am afraid.

You carry on calling street sex workers whores. I'll refer to them as "women" or "people".

From your description, Garden, 3rd wave doesn't sound like feminism at all. Feminism, to me, only makes sense as a class analysis. Saying "everything a woman does is feminist because it's a woman doing it" gives you no meaning for the word feminist.

If you don't believe me, try defining the word in a way that, using your definition, doesn't mean anything done by a woman for any reason.

No, but many third-wavers claim that it is one of the factors that distinguishes the third from the second wave.

And this overlooks the strong elements of intersectional feminism that have historically been part of the second wave. The US Civil Rights Movement helped give birth to the second wave Women's Movement in the US, and many second wave feminists, especially in the American South, where I am from, would identify as intersectional feminists.

English Collective of Prostitutes - prostitutescollective
prostitutescollective.net/

This charity uses both terms on its website.

Not all charities and others who work with prostitutes use terms like sex work.

See for example

spaceinternational.ie/mission/

There are many others too.

Prostitute = slur. Unless you are a "prostitute", what gives you the right to determine what this group of people are called?!?!?

Are you unfamiliar with the concept of a dictionary?

Let us say your job is cooking food in a commercial kitchen- you are a chef or a cook. If your job is delivering that food to customers at tables you are a waiter.

If you are the person standing up in front of a class of 5 year olds teaching them how to read and write you are a teacher.

I am a solicitor- society, the dictionary and my professional body names me as such.

I completely agree with Devi.

I am listening. I don't understand why prostitute = slur though. Your link didn't help. I tried to explain why I don't understand so there is no need to be like that

Sorry fruit I'm trying to get why prostitute is so bad and I really don't. Descriptors are a necessary part of language otherwise no one has a clue what's being discussed. Prostitute means someone who sells sex for money and doesn't seem offensive, unlike other terms like whore/hooker and even street walker.

You don't get it because you are not listening. Prostitute = slur. You may as well call these people whores, as that is what prostitute means.

Sorry fruit I'm trying to get why prostitute is so bad and I really don't. Descriptors are a necessary part of language otherwise no one has a clue what's being discussed. Prostitute means someone who sells sex for money and doesn't seem offensive, unlike other terms like whore/hooker and even street walker.
The article you linked to seems to imply that sex workers would like to reserve "prostitute" for women who've been trafficked. I'd define those women as slaves as they aren't freely exchanging sex for money.
To me the term sex workers is an umbrella term that includes the group "prostitutes" or "people who sell sex for money". I think insisting on refusing to use the term prostitute is being euphemistic.

Interestingly charities working with this group dont call people that exchange sex for money "prostitutes".

one25.org.uk

This is why I feel insisting on using the term "prostitute" is a veiled attempt at dehumanising these people and works to stigmatise them further.

www.google.co.uk/amp/junkee.com/sex-work-analogy-prostitute-slur/43410/amp?client=safari

Prostitute = slur. Unless you are a "prostitute", what gives you the right to determine what this group of people are called?!?!? This is why some types of feminism, particularly those crowded by white middle class women, will never be intersectional.

I disagree I have to say.
Not sure what you are disagreeing with

Scallop you really made a good point. That is a huge number of people. Most will be women and children. About eight months ago there was a report from amnesty saying rape was being used as weapon on the women there. Very Sad and sickening.

www.feministcurrent.com/2013/12/08/10-myths-about-prostitution-trafficking-and-the-nordic-model/
This is a really interesting article answering some of the so-called problems with the Nordic model.

I have also worked with women who have been exploited through prostitution. They hate the term sex work, considering that it gives legitimacy to their exploitation. They refer to themselves as prostitution survivors. Their voices are important too.

Of course "sex work" and "sex industry" includes pimps and brothel keepers or as Scot Pep calls them "management"

We believe that sex work is work, and deserves the same protections as other work sectors

We unequivocally oppose all forms of criminalisation of sex work (including sex workers, clients, management and others related to sex workers)
We call for the decriminalisation of sex work, including the purchase and sale of sex and other activities related to sex work

Anecdotal evidence doesn't amount to much in this context, FruitCider. I interviewed some prostitutes for work once and none of them had as issue with what they were called. My experience differs from yours and there are millions of prostitutes. There's no grounds for a conclusion either way.

Flower sellers were often prostitutes in Victorian times, conveying an unrealistic but attractive image of a woman on a London street corner with a fragrant basket of roses. However relabeling prostitutes "flower sellers" (or anything else for that matter) would just transfer the hideous statistics of rape, murder and addiction to another label. It wouldn't change the appalling nature of what they do. Calling it "sex work" makes it sound like any other job. You don't characteristically get raped as part of your working conditions in any other form of employment.

I have volunteered with women that walk the streets and they HATE being called prostitutes. You are missing the point entirely. Your insistence on using language that they find offensive shows that your view is extremely clipped and you are not interested in their needs whatsoever, you just want to push your own agenda.

Black men rarely look inward to think of the women and how this translate to racist or an outsider looking at the race and making judgment.
What I meant was they perpetuate some of the negative stereotypes of black women created during slavery and after. Intern this perpetuates racism and it does not help if you are trying to fight a cause that involves both sexes to stick together and move forward. The imbalance creates hatred and stifling of the movement. Most of the time it feels like they are in the fight only to gain power for themselves and not the women. I say this because they only ho ha is when the issue concerns black men. I blame the way society is built but you would think they would know better when it came to race issues.

I am sure there are lots of straight white men with mental health problems who are feminist and/or don't 'leave all childcare and house work to women'. Yes! That is true. However, the recent stats I read linked most of the male suicide to things related to what patriarchy as of them to achieve. During the financial crush you get a lot of men committing suicide too. Most linked to people who could not provide for their families or felt like failures. Lots of reason out their for suicide both in men and women and it's something we can't eradicate but if there are ways of how we can help, why not.

You already have your answer. Prostitution , prostitute or prostituted women are the words which describes what they do.

It is you who is insisting these words are unacceptable. I would reiterate my point, I can't think of any other job where the job description is so stigmatising it can't be used.

Rather emphasises prostitution is not a job.

I'm very happy for punters to be stigmatised. I'd be very happy for punters to be held in the same contempt that most people hold drunk drivers.

Again, that isn't the question I asked. We are not talking about punters being stigmatised. I am raising the point of women being stigmatised by the insistence of calling them prostitutes. What about their voice?

Agree Lass. Punters are scum. But we should broaden prostitution to include pornography. There's essentially no difference.

Why is it acceptable to stigmatise people who use sex to earn money by insisting on calling them prostitutes?

Answer the definition of prostitute is someone who sells sex for money

Still can't think of any other job or profession where using the dictionary definition for it is "stigmatising".

I'm very happy for punters to be stigmatised. I'd be very happy for punters to be held in the same contempt that most people hold drunk drivers.