Shannon Mathews

I agree with Lass and others re Maxine Carr btw.

I agree and emphathise with much of what I see posted on this forum. But posters seeking to paint Hindley and Matthews as somehow victims strikes me as beyond the pale.

Regarding the McCanns, whilst there's a significant swell of alternative thinking, the main reaction seems to be one of sympathy - a reaction that would've been inconceivable had they been a working class couple out clubbing. In that case, the main (only?) driver of people's reactions seems not to be sex but social class.

I agree a case could be made for Maxine Carr.

What Karen Mathews did to her child was horrific do you honestly think the mother is some sort of victim a poor uneducated woman so she didn't know any better is that what you are saying op?

I don't agree Kate McCann is the one who is demonised. Quite the opposite- when they are criticised the reference is usually to "the McCanns" in a way which reduces and dehumanises both of them. They morph in to a conjoined object of hate.

Articles which are favourable focus on Kate's suffering as a mother.

In either case their circumstances and loss don't bear the slightest comparison to what Karen Matthews did.

I do think Maxine Carr was unfairly treated by the press. Yes she lied but I don't think she believed for a second that he could have murdered the girls.

I think there is an interesting angle feminism-wise in comparing to the McCanns. As, regardless of opinions that would be deleted, it is always Kate that is the one demonised in whatever version people believe.

I hope it's clear that I'm not specifically sharing a deletable opinion here, just stating that on both sides, whether people believe she was taken or not, they blame the mother.

I thought similar about Maxine Carr. She did wrong and she spent time in prison for that, but why so much hate towards her?

She didn't kill the little girls, she wasn't anywhere near Soham at the time. She gave an alibi to someone she believed was innocent - that is why she was not convicted of assisting an offender.

Had she not given the +false alibi would the girls have been found sooner?

It's not just the fact that Myra Hindley murdered that made her a 'household name' it's the couple aspect that will always attract more publicity.

It sells papers, the idea that two people can meet and be as evil as the other, spurring each other on. Plus the fact they're in a sexual relationship which adds the 'perverted lovers' element.

Everyone knows who Fred and Rose West are.

People remember that Peter connellys mum was tracy but do they remember the names of the 2 men who killed him?

Possibly because their names were less prominently exposed at the time of the trial because of the other trial for child sex offenced involving them where they were not named to protect the anonymity of the victim ? The victim being another of Connelly's children.

Connelly herself is apparently now in a relationship with Toni Hewitson.

I would say Robert Black is as well known as Hindley.

It angers me that some people here seem to be apologists for female killers and abusers. Most murderers of children are male, but there are plenty of well documented cases where women are the perpetrators or it's joint enterprise.

I don't believe for a second that Myra Hindley was some poor victim of a dominating , persuasive male. She knew exactly what she was doing and deliberately led those children to their deaths.

Don't blame men for everything. Karen Mathews knew exactly what she was doing, as did Myra Hindley, as did Tracy Connoly, as did Rose West. Yes there are plenty of female victims of dominating, abusive men but the reverse is also true.

Just been reading up on Myra hindly apparently she was violent and abusive herself and I will not believe she is not as bad as Ian brady if she had any ounce of humanity about her she would have said where the bodies were buried

Re Brady and Hindley it's depressing to see excuses being made for her, particularly if it is the case neither had killed before they met the other.

Re Karen Matthews I agree with Pepperpot99

Deepan - we'll never know if he would have or not because they did meet.

What we also know Myra willingly engaged in the abuse and murder of children when she had ample opportunity to have prevented it.

And she then kept quiet about two of the murders for over 20 years while simultaneously expressing 'remorse' and gathering supporters to campaign for her release. Years of knowing she could help those families alleviate just a little bit of the torture they endured by telling them what happened to their children when they were begging her to. And she ignored it and denied all till Brady dropped her in it.

There has been plenty of research that shows female criminals are more notorious than males who commit the same crimes.

You can see the evidence in this thread- Myra hindley is a household name. Is robert black's?

People remember that Peter connellys mum was tracy but do they remember the names of the 2 men who killed him?

Sorry just seen someone mentioned her a minute ago. Had opened tab before that was posted.

For another woman what about Maxine thingy? The one who covered for Ian Huntley.

Could she be a better one to compare to Shannon Matthews mum. Certainly not quite the evil woman that was originally made out.- just very naive and easily led by someone rely nasty. Maybe?

There are plenty of women around who have not had the best start in life and who struggle in many ways. They don't all lock their own child up in a tiny drawer beneath a bed and allow a paeophile to live in their midst for a few quid though do they?
The day that KM decided to go ahead with her plan is the day she lost all rights. Her dc were all on the At Risk registers from birth.....seems to me all she cared about was money, fags and booze, plus shagging anything that looked at her. What a delightful example to her dc.

Sorry, I meant truth, not proof.

I think there's a lot of proof in your analysis, OP. Sure, it may not be possible to find a crime committed by a man that is directly comparable to Matthews' as a comparator, but there are plenty of men convicted of much more horrific crimes who don't get the attention she does. If such a man dyes his hair or changes the way he dresses, there is realistically no chance of the tabloids being interested.

See also Maxine Carr. The way she has been demonised by the press is grossly disproportionate to anything she did.

I think it's fair enough really.

As long as they are demonising the others too.

It's all hideous behaviour so all deserves to be criticised.

I once watched a documentary on female killers in with a psychologist said that Myra Hindley would never have done what she did had she not met Brady, she just had the type of personality that was very easy to manipulate. She was also obsessed with him and had been for some time before they became a couple.

I think Karen Matthews was quite rightly demonised. What kind of mother does something like that? I also take issue with the idea that she's 'thick' uneducated yes, but someone with low intelligence would never be able to concoct such a massive con.

Have you posted this because you've read she's found God?

Was he under the bed too?