Glamour Magazine allows transwoman to redefine feminism

*Tweeted by Juno just now:

Women need safe spaces. Trans women pose no threat to those safe spaces. To say otherwise is transphobia.*

Surely someone could tweet back links to where trans women have assaulted women and committed acts of voyeurism? And a selection of the hundreds of incidents of voyeurism and assault against women which occur yearly, which will be facilitated by allowing anyone who self identifies as a woman access to female spaces.

If the Independent is bandying about terms like TERF and starring out f*k and c*t willy nilly then maybe this madness is making people sit up.

The transwomen who keep their tackle and aggressively demand access to women's spaces are starting to shoot themselves in their Louboutin clad feet.

There are a couple of examples cited in the Indie article Datun. And also see here: www.dailywire.com/news/5190/5-times-transgender-men-abused-women-and-children-amanda-prestigiacomo#

If you google voyeurism in mixed changing though, there is about a prosecution a month. It's depressingly common.

I don't believe most transwomen want to use the women's toilets to assault women, I think it is largely about validation. But I do believe that self-identification makes it very easy to gain access to women-only spaces specifically to assault women.

Well, I think - as women - we can all agree on one thing: sometimes biology fucks us over. Those of us who can't get pregnant - less of a woman? Those of us who need mastectomies - less of a woman? Those of us (including me) on HRT - less womanly? I think I'm just one more woman who was royally fucked over by biology...

Fuck. That. Shit.

I cannot believe how angry reading that has made me, I really really wish I hadn't read it.

Somebody defined it really well upthread...
I knew somebody would pick me up on that...

I suppose I mean an 'old style' trans woman, ie somebody who was a feminine gay man who then went the whole op route and then lived as a woman.

Now these days, we have jokers with dicks and beards telling us they identify as women, and that we are TERFs who can move over! Who was that one Ada Wells? who was running for NUS women's officer? with a beard and a penis? I am sorry it is a fucking joke.

Obviously I do understand that not everybody would agree with this differentiation.

BratFarrar but how would you define a "real transwoman"?

I've been knocking around the LGBT+ community for a long time (though it wasn't called that then) and the people who for years I saw as my political siblings, and who I would have accepted as what is now called trans, neither denied their own maleness nor tried to push into women's spaces*, so "sharing my space" did not arise as an issue. But now when just saying so makes you trans, what is "real"?

*exception: gay clubs, where the women's loos were always full of people who cheerfully described themselves as "trannys" (whether that means they thought of themselves as drag queens or trans people I don't know) using the mirrors and chatting, but since it was clear to all concerned they had no sexual interest in women, it wasn't an issue for the lesbians there. Now the exact same scenario would make me fear for my safety, and mistrust every male-bodied person in those loos, and I would not be able to rely on all male-bodied people present having no sexual interest in women - far from it.

captain - or anyone else. I'm not on Twitter, but would it be possible to post some of the many links that show transwomen definitely have attacked women?

CaptainsCat dont argue with him or he will block you from Twitter!!

Sorry but this guy is an idiot. I have no objection to a real transwoman sharing my space but if any guy can slip on a frock and say that he now identifies as a woman then they can fuck right off.

The comments under the Independent article don't exactly warm the cockles though

Most UK women still don't have a clue what is being done behind their backs. Similar articles in the US - where trans issues have a much higher profile due to the bathroom law debate - attract comments that are overwhelmingly pro-Spartacus.

Tweeted by Juno just now:

Women need safe spaces. Trans women pose no threat to those safe spaces. To say otherwise is transphobia.

It makes my blood boil, this shutting down of womens' concerns. 'Agree with me, or you are a bigot! '

Gah, it makes me want to scream! I hope to god this bollocks has burnt itself out by the time my daughter reaches womanhood.

Yes, lots of sucking up to "LanaP"

True, Charlie.

The comments under the Independent article don't exactly warm the cockles though.

Datun I totally get that! And I understand the frustration, and occasionally the need to let rip. Our language is being policed all the time, particularly on this issue. But what Buffy said struck a chord with me, and while I can't promise always to be measured in what I say, I'll keep it in mind nonetheless.

I'm not clicking. My nerves can't take it.

Still Spartacus.

Buffy

Buffy I hear what you say. There's sometimes a measure of letting rip in what we are so often forbidden to say elsewhere, but I do agree that there's also a limit to what is both kind (even to people who are doing us harm) and what is politically expedient. I will keep this in mind when I post again.

I wanted to second what ArcheryAnnie said ^ I was a bit surprised to check in on my way home & find a rather heated run of posts after my cardi quip this morning. I totally understand the frustration but getting "frothy" just gives the TRAs ammo for screenshots. I thought the link someone posted to the transcritical health professionals' blog where a gay man had posted his take on the TRA agenda was really interesting. He wrote about how the gay rights agenda was different because it was just & did not encroach on others' rights. I see feminism the same way in this issue. We just need to keep stating our concerns in a clear, unambiguous and measured way. We have just cause. Venting when frustrated is understandable, but this is not a private space.

They don't really care which men get access to women's facilities because they are not afraid of other men. It's just lip service to achieve their goal of validation and forcing women to participate in their fetish. Otherwise, as you say, they would recognise the dangers of allowing anyone access based on self-identification.

missrissotto

I know it's not about safety for them it's about fetish and validation. I'm being slightly facetious, but on the other hand we (as feminists) are getting shouted down at every opportunity why don't we leave them to take this to its logical conclusion:they don't want access for all cocks so which ones are ok?

"even though the source of women's oppression often has everything to do with their bodies and their reproductive systems."

Well said, Independent

Good...there are some signs that the media is waking up to what's going on. There was a piece in the Times magazine on saturday about trans kids, which while sympathetic to the children they featured did give some balance about the issues with blockers and the criticism which is arising.

Great article from the Independent: www.independent.co.uk/voices/juno-dawson-glamour-magazine-terf-gender-identification-feminism-germaine-greer-a7403016.html

Oh dear yes I hadn't considered that Brat 😱

Thanks Prawn

ArcheryAnnie

It was quite interesting in the link that I posted above, that not ONCE did the panel say transwomen aren't women not ONCE did they say transmen aren't men, not once did they accuse any trans person of being predatory. They maintained throughout that EVERYONE should be safe from violence. They stuck with the theme of how can you tell the difference between a transwoman and a predator? And they were still subjected to all the usual insults, prevarication and 'what about us!'

Buffy I hear what you say. There's sometimes a measure of letting rip in what we are so often forbidden to say elsewhere, but I do agree that there's also a limit to what is both kind (even to people who are doing us harm) and what is politically expedient. I will keep this in mind when I post again.