woman loses residency of son she was raising as daughter

Plus I'm pretty sure you're not allowed to ask for it if you see a man in your changing room.

Seriously, what gone is making up these rules!

ATM thought the proof should be whether or not someone had a gender reassignment certificate. Except they're piss easy to get, and I, for one, wouldn't recognise one if you waved it in my face. It must be the work of a minute to fake one.

Yes you're right of course. A complete mind fuck

Except they don't even have to wear a dress, or shave or change any aspect of their appearance to be either a transwoman or self identify as one. It's a complete mind fuck.

I think some people believe that a man wouldn't 'lower' himself to wear female clothing unless he was 'genuinely trans'. Another side effect of the low status of women compared to men. So they don't believe that sexual predators would take advantage of self identification 😳

The thing is prawn most people who give it any thought are horrified. Particularly the kink aspect because it is so irrefutable (despite the attempts to erase it from Wikipedia).

I really don't understand how people don't immediately connect the dots.

Even if you believe in gender stereotypes, and I can understand why people do and even if you make a massive leap to think a transwoman has a female brain - even then, the inevitable exploitation involved in self identification must be glaringly obvious.

I didn't explain myself well, Venus. What I was talking about was MNers who signed up as Spartacus and said that they'd never heard about the trans agenda before it popped up on MN, but that once they understood what was going on they were as horrified as the rest of us.

I doubt Hanora will be back. The claims to have worked with offenders doesn't seem at all likely. If Hanora had done so, she would be aware of concerns about men in prison for sex offences claiming to be trans. It's a growing problem, discussed by those in the know.

What with general cluelessness about offenders and "womyn" ffs, I am unconvinced that Hanora knows of what she speaks.

hanora

This is a guest post on the blog of a brilliant transwoman.

www.aguycalledhelen.com/2016/09/04/male-violence-husbands-who-become-transwomen/

Research at the university of Minnesota found that 38% of transwomen are bisexual, 35% are attracted to women and 27% are attracted to men. This means that 73% of transwomen are sexually attracted to women. Given that we know that 80% of transwomen have a penis, the arguments for banning transwomen from women-only spaces remain very strong and coherent.

I can't consider someone who still has a penis any sort of woman. They're essentially a transvestite, though possibly with added hormones, even breast implants. If a man suffers from sex dysphoria to the extent that he'll have genital surgery then, on a personal level, I give them kudos, i.e. I take their claim seriously. Still don't want them in my changing room.

Yes, Prawn. And when they do get their heads around it, some of the offended people end up doing a 180. So free discussion outside the echo chamber is so important.

This isn't an echo chamber. People disagree. A bit. Before they flounce off. But that's because they don't have a decent argument or the courage of their convictions, not because anyone is censoring them.

Very good!

River's right. Kids today live on Tumblr. The 5 girls at one school who claim to be FTM will be getting all the fuel for their fire online. Most people don't discuss these issues in the flesh. There's a constant trickle of people on MN who turn up and are horrified by the TRA agenda but who have never been aware of the issue because it's not discussed in their circles. Teenagers know all about it, because so much of their life is online.

I've just seen this on Twitter and thought it was good. Why can't men be more accommodating, anyway??

1. A transwoman is a person born male who hates their genitalia so concludes they're a woman

Or

2. a transwoman is a fully intact male who is aroused by the idea of himself as female

Or
3) a sexual predator/voyeur/rapist puts on a dress and says he's a woman

And they're all in the changing room with an 11 year old girl.

hanora
Any suggestions ??

Cote only the worlds of Twitter and tumblr aren't tiny, and they are places that are doing far more to (mis)inform our youth that the average person on the street. And as governments around the world are heading more and more towards self-identification ('I am a woman because I say so'), then yes, all those words start to be rendered meaningless.

Hanora

Please set aside your feelings for just one moment and read the links posted above. Transgender women do indeed commit crimes (sexual or otherwise) at the exact same rate as men. It is one of the reasons women find it difficult to understand the 'I AM a woman' concept.

Furthermore there are many late transitioning MtT who suffer from autogynephilia - a sex based fetish where the man is sexually aroused by the thought of being a woman and it's enhanced by being in women's intimate spaces. It has been used to discredit the trans ideology in general so is being renamed 'cross-dreaming'. Dozens of sites online devoted to it. ATransMum said she tries to distance herself from those with AGP as she 'doesn't want anyone perving on her in the bathroom any more than you do.

Wake up.

Step outside the tiny world of Twitter & Tumblr and you will see that these words mean exactly the same things as they always have to the vast majority of people on the street.

At the moment yes - the problem is the whole trans narrative is going mainstream, eg this column in Glamour magazine, which is problematic for a number of reasons...

www.glamourmagazine.co.uk/features/living-travel/2016/11/what-it-means-to-be-a-real-feminist

"We've lost woman and vagina and mother and FGM and women's issues"

Err no we haven't. Step outside the tiny world of Twitter & Tumblr and you will see that these words mean exactly the same things as they always have to the vast majority of people on the street.

The claim could not be made about any group of people

True, quite apart from the fact that transactivists don't tend to be shy of issuing rape threats and inciting their followers to 'kill terfs'

Transwomyn! I've seen it all now.

You do not know what you are on about if you think that's an acceptable way to use that word, Hanora. Don't make me add "womyn" to the list of appropriated language. We've lost woman and vagina and mother and FGM and women's issues and god alone knows what else that now doesn't mean what it's supposed to mean any more. Where does it end?

To claim that a person would not commit an offence is the most ludicrous statement ever
That claim could not ba made about any group of people

I am utterly enraged by Hanora,s appropriation of the word womyn, a word coined by feminists to take the 'men' out of 'women'. How fucking dare you use it with regard to males?

I'm another one not bothered by the squeals of transpobia, probably because I know what the word phobia means (same as I know what man, woman, male and female mean) and I know that neither I nor anyone else on these threads have a phobia of trans people.

80% of trans people don't have 'bottom' surgery. Those males who don't are therefore just as much a threat to women as any other male, therefore as we can't know who is a transsexual and who is a male in a frock, the safest solution is clearly to keep certain spaces segregated by sex.

Good article on this case

www.transgendertrend.com/uk-court-case-exposes-social-services-in-thrall-to-transgender-orthodoxy/

I'll be honest here, it worries me when I read that it was possibly a miscarriage of justice when FtT were imprisoned for lying about their gender. There's no miscarriage -,people should be told when in or entering a relationship. It's important, like it is about any relevant history. If they can't accept you for your decisions you have had to make for yourself, then they never deserved your time. But to lie in these cases were wrong and totally illegal. If it turns out my child does infact have gender dysmorphia and takes the path to change then she will be forced by me to inexplicably tell whomever she gets into a relationship with.

Just like there was no excuse based upon that report, for the mother to push her views on her child

Both situations in my view were dealt with correctly