Ched Evans verdict

I agree that the onus should be on the accused rapist to prove that he didn't rape, rather the victim having to prove that he did. Much easier to prove that he was given consent, if he was.

Victims should be interviewed separately, on camera. Not in Court, and each Counsel should interview separately. None of this silly combatorial stuff "I put it to you that you said yes!!!" strutting about, finger pointing, bully boy rubbish. You

I think a victim giving video evidence should be enough

Or, actually, punching in the face doesn't convey the risk of STD/pregnancy, which obviously have life long effects that a punch in the face might not (as dangerous as a punch in the face is)

How about if I tattooed you, while drunk using my needle gun, which you have no idea who else has been tattooed by. Shouldn't I have to prove that I had permission to tattoo, rather than the tattooee having to prove that I didn't?

That Belgian girl with the stars all over her face was believed until the tattooist was able to produce evidence beyond all reasonable doubt that she had asked to be tattooed. Treat rape like that. I need to prove beyond all reasonable doubt that you had permission, not you that I didn't.

Well, it seems to me, that in another case - lets say punching someone in the face - that if you say I punched you in the face, I say I punched you in the face, and you say that you didn't want me to punch you in the face, despite the fact that you're an amateur MMA fighter, and regularly get punched in the face for fun as part of your hobby, I would still be prosecuted, still through court, but I doubt the jury would have any problem convicting me. I expect that if I hit you when you were fall down drunk, that that would be considered a worse offence even.

How about we treat rape like that? If you are proven to have sex with a woman who says that you raped her, then, just as if it were a punch, you are proven to be guilty.

Why on earth does it matter whether he thinks he had consent? We have the person giving the consent right in front of us, just ask her!

If course that is irrelevant to the Ched case anyway Homer because the woman in question never claimed to have been raped. She claimed to not remember. It was Ched originally caused the police to believe he was a rapist. If jurors don't even believe a man when inhis interview he said he behaved in a way that had all the hallmarks of a rape incident, the chances of people believing female victims are low to nil.

@Venus. No, I just don't want women who have been raped to have to go through a trial.

If we believe women when they say they've been raped, then that means believing the men are guilty; and so what is the point of the trial?

Javan Vidal, who would later receive a suspended prison sentence for knocking a woman to the ground and kicking her that night.

Mustn't have been able to find two other men to say the victim deliberately fell infront of their feet on separate occasions. Maybe they didn't offer as much as £50k.

"Drunken Javan Vidal, 22, of Lee Crescent, Stretford, was shown on the footage repeatedly hurling blonde Amy Temple, 22, to the ground and kicking her after she had butted him to the face.., Another man allegedly made a remark to Temple, who had been drinking. She head-butted Vidal who then threw her to the ground and as other men tried to drag him away he followed her down the street, knocked her to the ground several times and kicked her. At one stage Vidal appeared to try to push her into the path of a taxi but the driver avoided her. "

I wonder who the "other man" was.

From another article:
"Andy Hutchinson, for Temple, said she, too, had been drinking and had responded to comments of a sexual nature."

They just have utter contempt for women, the lot of them who were out that night.

'On the night in question, Evans was out with McDonald and another footballer, Javan Vidal, who would later receive a suspended prison sentence for knocking a woman to the ground and kicking her that night. Evans had become separated from his friends when he received a text from McDonald which read “I got a bird"'

Blimey. All round group of top lads.

And he was on his way to the police station to support this Javan, but changed his mind and asked the taxi to turn around so he could stick his dick into a woman who he had never met. Top, top lad.

I feel Homer fancies him/herself as a great wit.

I do wonder what would happen if we abolished trials for rape and just believed victims. Not suggesting jail as a punishment either - people tend to get more violent in jail after all. Some kind of intensive consent coaching course. Jail would be reserved for very violent or repeat offenders.

After all a woman can only 'cry rape' if you're alone with her. It's inherently dangerous for women to be alone with men, it might balance things out a bit for us if it was inherently dangerous for men too.

'Should we abolish trials for men accused of rape, and just jail them?'

What kind of question is this? I can't tell if it's sarcastic.

At the very least we should not bring up the woman's sexual history and there should be strong penalties (which are pursued) for media and social media identification.

There should be stronger rules about cross-examination and juries on rape cases should get training in the laws around rape and consent before they sit in court.

I don't think jail without a day in court is the way to go, no. That would be ridiculous. I am surprised at the grounds on which this re-trial was granted though.

The way things have gone, I do feel they might as well change the definition of rape if there is no way in hell most accusations can be proven. So why bother giving the victim the impression that the law is there to protect her. Just say she asked for it. That's literally all you need to do. There will always be doubt that the woman is telling the truth, and all the defendant has to do is convince the jury that their doubt is reasonable and, boom, acquittal. She asked me to go harder, she liked it rough, she had sex with me before, she had sex with someone else before, she had sex with someone after, she clearly likes sex, what proof is there that she didn't like it, have capacity to ask for it and ask for it on this occasion? You can invent whatever narrative you like.

I know men can be raped too, but I've only referred to women above because, let's face it, there is a whole lot moe sympathy for male rape victims and there is not a culture of doubting their claims.

And I say none of this as a legal expert or someone wanting a lively pub debate where we all play devil's advocate, I say this as someone who has been raped, and know that the men who raped me knew what they were doing, and knew they would never be punished for it, because that's how tnings are.

We should have trials where it is clear that witnesses haven't been bribed.

We should have trials where it is absolutely clear what the judge was thinking when evidence from other sexual partners was allowed to be introduced.

At the moment that is not the case here.

We should have trials where the defence don't act in a way that encourages abuse of the victim. That certainly isn't the case here.

Should we abolish trials for men accused of rape, and just jail them? It would mean women wouldn't have to endure going through a trial, which is very traumatic; and as this thread shows - being found not guilty just means he got away with it.

Having a trial means we are questioning the woman's story, which is typical of a patriarchal society.

He was invited into the room by his mate, and consent is transferable these days

I'm using the more common definition of Being invited into a locked room that involves the door being opened for you.

The kind where you don't have to lie to get a key. I just think that as a vampire, CE would have had trouble getting over that threshold.

“When they are drunk, think twice about it.”

Oh my god. How about when they are drunk DON'T FUCKING RAPE THEM!!!!

He was invited into the room by his mate, and consent is transferable these days.

YY Marble. The idea of Ched Evans lecturing young people about alcohol and consent makes my blood boil.

“I have maintained my innocence from day one so I can never apologise directly for what happened but I can apologise for the effect it’s had"

He doesn't appear to have grown at all. He talks about alcohol, but doesn't appear to understand that other vague signs that you might look out for are

1. you have spoken to the person with whom you are having sex
2. you were invited into the room.

Other nice touches are not having a gang of friends outside the window filming the incident.

It appears that in his eyes, the thing that he did wrong was get caught.

He's so delusional.

I don't think I can stomach reading that. He's a disgraceful cunt. He's basically Brock Turner's Welsh twin.

Well I'm interested in the "young women: how to avoid a man entering a hotel room by deception and sticking his penis into you" classes

lass

What a twat

Young footballers, not models

This is unbelievable. He's setting himself up as some sort of educational role model for young models and apparently thinking of suing Brabners, his former solicitors.

Ched Evans calls for more education on alcohol and consent

www.theguardian.com/football/2016/oct/16/ched-evans-calls-for-education-on-alcohol-and-consent?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard