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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

If I can change my sex, why can't I change my race?

63 replies

fakenamefornow · 27/09/2016 23:10

I am white British, family all.white British, from England. I have blond hair and blue eyes. I do have some African blood though, many generations back, I don't feel African in any way though, never even been there, and feel no particular connection to the continent. I love my African heritage though, just because it's interesting.

If I had a black husband, black children lived among a black community and this was were I felt most comfortable, why couldn't I describe myself as black? Actually I think know why, I just don't understand why changing sex (or rather gender) is treated so differently, when sex, unlike race, really is binary. Not wanting to offend anyone and apologies if I haven't used the corrected terms. I really am curious though.

OP posts:
QueenJuggler · 28/09/2016 16:18

Race is highly emotive because of the historical and current discrimination that is endured by minority race communities, especially black communities. Identify yourself as whatever you want, but IMO, don't expect me to believe that we are the "same" and that you've walked a mile in my shoes.

olderthanyouthink · 28/09/2016 16:06

I'm saying it IS a social construct

(Sorry got distracted)

olderthanyouthink · 28/09/2016 16:01

I'm saying it's not a social construct because it lumps massive amounts of people to together in a not very scientific way because who is and isn't black varies by culture.

fakenamefornow · 28/09/2016 15:26

I suppose it is working on the premise that all human beings can breed, therefore we are all the same race? Personally I think we are different races but prepared to change my view if persuaded.

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OlennasWimple · 28/09/2016 15:22

Is race a social construct? Confused

fakenamefornow · 28/09/2016 14:41

I guess the controversy about Rachel Dolezal was fuelled, in part, by the fact that she was seen to be taking the place, in civil rights campaigning, that belonged to a black person?

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scaevola · 28/09/2016 06:52

Mixed race is for more common than intersex. People who are intersex nominate the sex they want to live as, so in OP's case then yes just choosing is possible. Because intersex people usually have their sex assigned to them by their parents at birth, but it might well be totally wrong for them and they choose to change later.

In other cases, then yes it is also possible, and acceptance by the community is the. Key point.

Did anyone ever really consider Hayley Cropper a man? Other than of course people portrayed as bigoys such as Les Battersby?

olderthanyouthink · 28/09/2016 06:39

I've never understood this. Race is a pretty made up social construct and it's waaaaay more wobbly than sex or even gender.

I'm mixed race so I don't fit into a box easily, I'm often asked why I'm not more black or it's commented that I'm very white.... That's nothing to do with my skin colour (though I'm relatively pale as I don't go outside that much) but it's to do with how I behave relative to racial stereotypes.

On the flip side I'm often put into the category of black because I live in a white country, grew up in and live in very white areas and I'm not like the majority so I must be the other (it's a shame that it always black v white and skips over the other races). I've never been to a mostly black country before so I don't know how I would be seen there.

I often describe myself as grey because it's a bit more descriptive than mixed race and just to increase my awkwardness of not fitting in a box. I'm fine with being mixed, I don't think most trans people are entirely one or the other gender, like I'm not entirely one "race" so why can't they just be who they want without the whole uprising thing (bit of an understatement). They can't change their sex any more than I can change my ancestry the makes me mixed "race".

ICJump · 28/09/2016 05:43

In Australia, where we systematically tried to kill all the Aboriginals or if that too unseemly tried to breed it out by taking light skinned kids and telling them they were white, one for the markers of your aboriginality is if you are accepted by the community as aboriginal.
In areas like Tasmania when the last full blooded aboriginal died in the 1870s many aboriginal people look quite white but they a seen by their community as black. Similarly I have white friends who through marriage become "aunty"s and "Uncle"s and are considered part of an aborginal family.

There is also a guy in NT who is Scottish by birth but is considered Yolngu by his Yolngu family and community

So the short answer is if your family and your community consider you black then maybe you are.
As for trans changing sex given that lots of women are saying we don't accept that you are women I'm not sure they can say they become women

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 28/09/2016 00:43

Why do so many white people claim to be Native American? | Fusion
fusion.net/story/279637/white-people-claiming-native-identity/

Shallishanti · 27/09/2016 23:37

oh in that case go for it
am feeling a bit mentally underpowered right now, but I think there's some mileage in comparing race with gender (but not sex)- as race is an arbitrary social construct, like gender, whereas sex is an objective biological concept.
The woman who claimed to be black was derided, rightly so because 'race' is the source of real oppression- but sex is also the source of real oppression, with gender being a tool for the oppression
or something

fakenamefornow · 27/09/2016 23:18

Yes I know. I only have to go back about 150 years to find my African ancestry though.

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Shallishanti · 27/09/2016 23:15

actually we ARE all africans