The Abortion Episode.

"but simply as "I wasn't in a place where I could have a child, so I had an abortion"?"

IIRC, this was how Carrie viewed her abortion in the SATC episode.

I loved the Bojack 'abortion episode'. Don't have much to add but found it refreshing.

No you are not always going to regret what lead to it.

I had an abortion and I felt nothing but glad that I had the option. I didn't have any sorrow about the circs that lead up to it (much wanted pregnancy so all my choice) but I was hugely glad that I could have an abortion (medical reasons). Equally I could have had rather joyful unprotected sex and got unlucky. I wouldn't feel that I should "regret what lead to it". I would like the right to think - "oh bugger, but thank goodness I'm in charge of what happens next".

I totally agree with your point OP. Abortion can be a good thing. Not the best of a bad job but a good thing. But we are not allowed to say that.

Of course many women struggle with the decision and afterwards but many don't. We only ever see the struggle portrayed - not the other story.

I think the social messages we get about abortion in the UK are that it's OK if you really have to, but you have to feel bad about it and you have to angst long and hard over it. I think that the reason some women suffer guilt etc afterwards is because of this social pressure for it to be a big deal.

They never show the hideous throngs of religious protestors who congregate outside abortion clinics in the US in TV / film...

I think abortion is still pretty taboo in both the US and the UK. It's not something generally discussed, and is seen as something to be hushed up. Given this, it's not surprising that it is used as a plot device in a more or less sensational way, surely?

People might enjoy the Episode called 'Holly's Choice' from the US series China Beach. As I recall, it was shot backwards, after the central character had chosen a termination, and put the 'pro-life' and 'pro-choice' camps' positions eloquently and, at the same time, with almost full-frontal honesty. I don't recall any moralising on the behalf of the scriptwriters. It wasn't a pretty episode, though, and I recall being quite unsettled by it because my favourite character was 'pro-life' and because the decision had a range of consequences for friendships and trust. It was not portrayed as an easy decision, and there was no ending that saw things being worked out happily for all. Mind you, I haven't seen it for a long, long time.

The UK series Skins had a character who had an abortion, and it was in a story arc where I really expected them to go down the "kept the baby and now it's lovely" storyline. Instead they were very realistic about it and it was overhyped or emotional either. I think it was well done in a show aimed at teens.

I have had an abortion. It was forced in that my family threatened to disown me and my mum (previous mh issues) threatened suicide. I don't feel guilty as I was 19 and quite frankly an idiot. However it did leave me with a medical condition that meant carrying further children very,very difficult. I think this is an issue that is often ignored,you may recover emotionally or indeed not feel emotional at all but there can be lasting physical repurcussions for some women. Personally I would never want any woman to feel guilty about an abortion but neither do I think we should be blasé about it.

"that said, she pretty much is the Awful Warning character - based on a woman Marc Cherry knew of who had killed her children, I think he said..." Ha ha! what does it say about me that she was the character in Desperate Housewives that I most identified with? I particularly loved the episode where after cherry picking the good bits of parenting for far too long, her husband finally gets cornered into doing some actual childcare - so she deliberately gets the hyperactive twins hyped up on sugar before she goes out.

I still remember (old gimmer here) the episode of Cagney and Lacey that tackled abortion - with the twist that I think everyone in the audience expected Cagney (single woman with lots of sexual partners) to be the socially liberal one - but in fact it turned out Lacey was the one who'd had an abortion, and Cagney, being Catholic, was opposed to them. Can you imagine a TV series these days where one of the lead characters would be allowed to have had an abortion without it being portrayed as "major character flaw"/"angsty back story which explains all her current psychological problems", but simply as "I wasn't in a place where I could have a child, so I had an abortion"?

tend

It's ok... I do then to ramble :)

Miffer what i meant is they regret having to go through an abortion,rather than the baby itself,as a (badly expressed i guess)point that even regret takes various forms.

But it's telly! They have to turn everything into a huge drama. Because real life is as dull as shit really.

Take Eastenders - how many characters have either killed someone or tried to? Ben, Ronnie, Stacey, Martin, Lauren, Dean, Shirley, Mick, Vincent, Claudette all come to mind.

No one ever decides to try for a baby, tries for a few months and then gets pregnant. Either you get pregnant completely accidentally (by someone else's husband) or you are tragically infertile.

Giving birth - have any of them actually made it to hospital?

Why would abortion be treated any differently? Got To Drag Maximum Drama Out.

I tend to suspect that most women who feel guilty about abortion do so because of the circumstances - ie they didn't really want an abortion but the circumstances they were in meant they couldn't go on with the pregnancy. A significant number of these regretted decisions will have been made in response to the actions of the man: he didn't want a baby (but still went ahead and have the sex), he was completely useless with his existing children, he was a controlling bully, there was DV, there was a background of reprotductive coercion, he left when the woman got pg, etc etc etc.

You really don't see these themes explored in film or tv, do you?

Of course I'm also delighted to see women represented who make free choices and then feel no regret - but as I said above, I reckon most women who regret terminations didn't have wholly free choice.

Lynette was supposed to have an abortion with her 75th or whatever it was. in Desperate Housewives, they decided against it because of what the audience would say

that said, she pretty much is the Awful Warning character - based on a woman Marc Cherry knew of who had killed her children, I think he said...

so I suppose that's something.

I had an abortion 12 years ago, at 17 year old. I remember feeling guilty at how not guilty I felt too. I thought there was something wrong with me tbh as everything I' knew' about abortion was that it was a terrible terrible thing but it was right for me at that time. I do still think 'what if' to this day, but I never ever regretted it.

The thing is you cannot put feelings and human reactions in neat little boxes and say women...this are the acceptable ways of how you should feel. So far on tv there are mostly two options keep the baby in the end or wretched with guilt for ever and ever,and dismissing all the other perfectly normal reactions.
The same is valid for regret,some women might regret the actual baby,some might regret the particular circumstances that led to one(being forced,being in a vulnerable situation mentally or financially,illness etc), some might regret the fact that they had to do it(by being pregnant in the first place),some might regret it from reasons i can't even think of and some might not regret it at all.

Most of the women i know that regret it,when asked if they could go back in time they would choose not getting pregnant in the first place,rather than stopping the abortion.

And I'm not sure that my statement that women tend not to regret their choice of having an abortion equates to them having no qualms about it. That's not the same thing at all. Still, again, I am sorry your friends regret their abortions Pepperpot, I hope they are able to access the excellent help that's available for women in their position.

I'd agree Cat.

Pepper, I haven't dismissed anyone, in fact, I explicitly stated that I am fully aware that it is a painful choice for some. Your anecdata means nothing I'm afraid, but I do feel for those women you know who regret their abortions. I know you're looking for a fight, and I'm sorry, but I am not going to give that to you. I don't live in a neat world, I find it astounding that your assumption is that I might.

Abortion and mental health

Another article

A third that suggests that 95% of women don't regret having an abortion. I'm not sure that that figure dismisses the 5% of women who did, it merely puts it into perspective.

Yes Pepperpot, and it's a good thing to represent all the different ways in which abortion affects individuals rather than just the Hollywood ending version where the woman changes her mind at the last minute and lives happily ever after and the devastated woman, destroyed by her decision for all of eternity. There is another emotional outcome that is almost never portrayed in the media. And getting snipey with Bucking over her support of an increase in the third portrayal is unnecessary.

It can be painful and awful for some women, but for some it's the opposite. I think the point here is that on tv it is often overlooked that women can have different feelings about it, and it is the pain/guilt that is emphasised almost all of the time. This can then cause more issues and guilt for women who were glad/relieved after an abortion, as they feel like this is how they 'should' feel, and that causes guilt.
A more balanced portrayal is definitely needed.