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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

My son is sexist.

83 replies

Clarabumps · 19/08/2016 07:44

My son has just turned 9.

Dp has always treated me with the utmost respect and although I am a stay at home mum, I have free financial rein and I have never felt in any way held back by my non working outside the home status if you know what I mean.
My son has increasingly been making sexist statements about strength and abilities of women to do things. I'd consider myself a feminist as is dp and I'm honestly struggling to find out where these views are coming from.
"Sure boys are far stronger than girls?"
"A woman can't be a builder"
"Boys are better at maths and stuff than girls"
I'm totally dumbfounded. He says things like this a lot. I keep reiterating that women can do anything a man can do but I'm not sure I'm doing enough.
I don't know if it's the fact that I'm at home that he sees my role as worthless. Maybe I'm over thinking this. I'd appreciate any advice on where to go from here. I feel both me and dps are talking to the wall when trying to combat this.
It really seems ingrained in society. It's worrying me.

OP posts:
JacquettaWoodville · 20/08/2016 09:40

"their home life will be the largest single influence on small children."

The son is 9. TV, society, school, magazines, friends, cub leaders etc all have an influence.

JacquettaWoodville · 20/08/2016 09:37

"The OP's husband should give up work to allow the OP to get back into the workplace and build her career - that would be a very powerful message to send their child."

A powerful message about making an economically stupid decision?

If OP hasn't worked for 9-10 years (guesstimate) then her earning power will be affected.

All families have to get earning work, caring work and domestic work done. Each finds a balance of who does what and what is "bought in"

Yes, I would prefer there to be far less "default" in the balance but to assume that the OP's son's position is only a result of the SAHM/WOHD set up in their family is very naive.

JacquettaWoodville · 20/08/2016 09:32

Eh?

Her son isn't saying "women can't work". He's saying women can't be builders and men are stronger.

Unless OP was a builder or a weightlifter, her having a job wouldn't counteract these particular sentiments!

whattheseithakasmean · 20/08/2016 09:26

I would agree with your laudable sentiments if there were equal numbers of men and women staying home/scaling down their careers to raise their families. But the fact is, the default position for women to give up/scale down work to enable men to concentrate on their careers and thus become bigger earners therefore perpetuating the inequalities down the generations, of men out in the world while women are confined to the domestic sphere. If you want society to be any different, you need to be part of that change. The OP's husband should give up work to allow the OP to get back into the workplace and build her career - that would be a very powerful message to send their child.

Xenophile · 20/08/2016 09:26

So, what you're saying is:

a) this is all the fault of his mother, if she worked then her son wouldn't be repeating sexist tropes he hears at school.
b) that unpaid caring work that women do is worth absolutely nothing, despite that capitalism relies on it to function.
c) you have little understanding of children's social development and have failed to comprehend the weight of peer influence at the stage this child is at.
d) it's all women's fault in general, and women should stop whining.
e) that women should be forced to go and work, in spite of their family's needs, inclination and ability.
f) that only the children of families where there is a SAHM are sexist.

davos · 20/08/2016 08:52

It seems futile to blame society when you have recreated a microcosm of society that will impact more strongly on your young child's unconscious expectations that any TV ad.

as a mother that works I disagree. It's not the being the sahm that matters. Does the other person respect the work the sahm puts in? Do the kids respect it? Is being a sahm what the mother wants to do? Or does she feel forced? Is she an equal partner?

Being a sahm does not mean your are supporting sexism or creating sexist children or an environment that supports societies sexist view.

Being a sahm should be viewed as being important as the person working outside the home. The only way we can change the way the world views sahp, is by teaching our children the value of it.

whattheseithakasmean · 20/08/2016 08:22

All mothers work Indeed, as do fathers. But when you have chosen to give up paid work while the father continues to go out and earn, you are perpetuating a societal norm and of course their home life will be the largest single influence on small children. It seems futile to blame society when you have recreated a microcosm of society that will impact more strongly on your young child's unconscious expectations that any TV ad. You need to be the change you want to see in the world, but I do realise that is hard for most people. It is easier to slip into traditional roles, then blame everyone else for your child's perceptions.

JacquettaWoodville · 20/08/2016 06:31

I work more hours than DH and my kids still think pink is for girls etc.

Xenophile · 19/08/2016 23:18

All mothers work

whattheseithakasmean · 19/08/2016 23:04

It is tricky when you are at home nurturing and his dad is out in the world earning. Is there any particular reason why you don't work and his dad does?

Xenophile · 19/08/2016 22:56

Jacquetta, you're not allowed to gainsay Vitreous, he gets ever so upset about it. Ignoring is a better idea.

SeraOfeliaFalfurrias · 19/08/2016 21:02

Your son isn't sexist, he lives in a sexist society and receives messages on a daily basis. My DDs only ever went to female doctors and still spouted the old 'men are doctors and women are nurses' bullshit. As others have suggested, just counter the stereotypes with daily examples of how these stereotypes just aren't true. Kids aren't stupid, just brainwashed.

JacquettaWoodville · 19/08/2016 20:55

Bit of a non sequitur, vitreous.

Still, better than you telling us againhow sexy you find teenagers in leotards, eh?

Xenophile · 19/08/2016 20:41

I doubt this has much to do with your being a SAHM.

All you can do is keep gently challenging his assertions. He'll be hearing a lot of this from school peers, who might be hearing these views articulated at home or be getting them from TV/Youtube etc.

It's also a fairly normal part of growing up, where children try to 'sort' people into roles in order to try and work out what their role is, if that makes sense? This is why challenging these ideas is so important.

VitreousEnamel · 19/08/2016 18:15

Interesting that women seem to think men can't x.

Did they learn that as children and dobthey challenge their daughters?

tribpot · 19/08/2016 16:54

This is an .

Egosumquisum · 19/08/2016 16:22

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Rolypoly · 19/08/2016 12:55

He has reached the age where he is trying to find his place in the world, what it means to be male. He is trying to identify what 'the world' expects from him. He is getting his cues from all sorts of sources. That is why children say things like 'women can't be firefighters' even if their own mum is a firefighter. There is a difference between their world and the world around them.
I used to challenge these type of comments with my own sons and use the opportunity to discuss why these ideas exist. They need guidance to develop their own personalities in this respect as in all others. My two teenage boys have developed into lads with a fairly feminist outlook so there's plenty of time for your lad.

grimbletart · 19/08/2016 12:38

I have told him in the past that the only difference is that boys have penises and girls don't.

Or alternatively (but how often do you hear this) girls have a uterus that can grow a whole new human being) and boys don't. Smile

VestalVirgin · 19/08/2016 11:58

Wow, you are a saint for putting up with this. I'd tell him that his mother is a woman, too, and to watch his tongue.
And punish him. No more TV - actually, since TV is where boys get much of this shit, that'd actually be effective in more ways than one.

I'm aware that punishing him for saying it might lead to him just keeping his sexist attitude to himself, while still having it, but I wouldn't have the strength to put up with hatespeech by my own child.

Giving him a book on female Nobel Prize winners for Christmas is probably better, though.

ChocChocPorridge · 19/08/2016 10:09

I agree with the above - the best way I've found with mine (admittedly younger - 6, the 2 year old isn't doing it yet) is to ask why he thinks that, challenge it, ask him to justify why pink is a girls colour or whatever - anything to get him to really think through what he's just said - a kind of teach a man to fish approach.

Generally it works, and he just ignores anyone who tells him otherwise (and, I'm proud, puts anyone in their place who tells other people stuff like this around him). We've even got to the stage of eye rolling should I question something he says, so I know it's got in there.

Doublemint · 19/08/2016 09:33

You could also check out www.amightygirl.com for books and resources that challenge typical gender roles and also have articles and books about women in STEM

BristolLFR · 19/08/2016 09:33

Order this in time for Christmas

www.kickstarter.com/projects/timbuktu/good-night-stories-for-rebel-girls-100-tales-to-dr

It's a fab book on Kickstarter which tells the stories of 100 amazing women through history

WantToRunAgain · 19/08/2016 08:48

Sadly a lot of this crap comes from other parents and wider society - just keep challenging it and back up your examples.

Resist the temptation that some seem to have to go the other way and denigrate boys - think we can sing the praises of both genders with our children and still make a valid point Smile

EenyMeenyMo · 19/08/2016 08:36

they pick it up everywhere. DS(6) comes up with some of this stuff - girls can't do x etc boys can't wear pink. I'm the breadwinner in our family- DP a SAHP so his role models do not enforce this. I just try and say that everyone can do anything they want and that some people are good at somethings and not at others. I have told him in the past that the only difference is that boys have penises and girls don't.
it is difficult though - at school the boys play together and not with the girls and some things seemed badly designed- football club clashes with dance club and creates gender divide. But then I remember at 18months a mum friend telling me that it was a shame that her little girl couldn't go to a preschool football class I assumed that it was a timing issue - the mum then blushed and confessed that she assumed her dd couldn't go/shouldn't go because she's a girl. The same family constantly told their DD to act as a lady/sit nicely like a lady etc - be quiet etc, very different to their son. The child learns these attitudes takes them to nursery/school and they impinge on others