General Trans Thread Part 3

As a former world star of women's athletics, O'Sullivan is very well qualified to see the great danger to women's sports. I hope people listen to her.

www.irishtimes.com/sport/sonia-o-sullivan-intersex-athletes-and-the-problem-of-testosterone-1.2677419

You don't need to register, my original link didn't work because I'd exceeded the weekly allowance of 10 articles. She's writing about the problems associated with the relaxation of the rules for participants in female sporting events, opening them up not just to those with rare genetic conditions like Caster Semenya but anyone who wants to call themselves a woman really.

I have just signed up for a Kindle version of Female Erasure. So what if the editor is a hippy? At least someone has the courage to talk about what is happening, despite the inevitable backlash.

Has anyone seen this yet?

[https://gendertrender.wordpress.com/2016/06/08/female-erasure-what-you-need-to-know-about-gender-politics-war-on-women-the-female-sex-and-human-rights/]

[https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/female-erasure--2#/]

It has plenty of well known rad fem contributors (Germaine Greer does the introduction or foreword I think, Sheila Jeffreys, Eliabeth Hungerford, Gallus Mag, Lierre Kieth, Suzanne Gray...) but the main author/editor seems to be an "ordained elder Priestess, seasoned ritualist," and an "award winning pioneering goddess-centered folk musician, mountain dulcimer artist" amongst other things. Which makes me immediately slightly suspicious! What are everyone's thoughts?

This shit makes me so angry - it's happening in plain view and we are still branded hateful transphobes for saying that men aren't women

I don't venture onto twitter much Where - how do people usually respond? Are people used to it?

I'm not subscribed and can't be bothered creating an account *shins". Is it about trans athletes or more about intersex? What's this spanner in the works?

www.irishtimes.com/sport/sonia-o-sullivan-intersex-athletes-and-the-problem-of-testosterone-1.2677419?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fsport%2Fsonia-o-sullivan-intersex-athletes-and-the-problem-of-testosterone-1.2677419

Sonia sticks up for female athletes. Although I think she's conflating intersex with trans.

This stuff around abortion is happening here too. I've seen it on Twitter. Trans activists calling for abortion campaigners to talk about "people with wombs".
Yes, of course it's possible that a transman who hasn't had surgical gender reassignment could get pregnant, but are we seriously going to stop using the word "woman" and deny the experiences of 50% of the population just so a teeny minority of people who are biologically women (but happen to be unhappy about that fact) don't feel left out or awkward?

This issue really, really pisses me off actually. The fight for abortion rights just seems so emblematic of the feminist movement and gains women have made over the decades arguing for automony over our bodies and reproductive choices. For all that to be shat on by a handful of people intent on pushing the boundaries of identity politics just fills me with rage. It's navel gazing. Meanwhile in the real world, women and girls are being imprisoned for miscarrying in some countries and being left to die in hospital because of draconian abortion laws as close to home as Ireland.
So as well as fighting for women's right to choose, we now have to fight numpties who challenge our right to even use the word woman to describe ourselves.

I'm trying to work out what everyone's talking about almond - I'm confused as are you about Bumbledumb's point. But I now see she is also confused.

It's fortunate that we have you here sixpence, to consistently re-iterate what genderist arguments are, just in case anyone forgets.

I'm confused. Did they not just share an article about trans health care issues in general? I don't think it said anywhere that transwomen need abortions? Or are asking for them? Although I get why people don't think it should be what they're focused on. Which isn't to say (female) transmen don't sometimes get pregnant.

I got mixed up, apologies.

The link you've posted isn't the article that the post was made in response to.

I can't follow what point you're making Bumble, because you're responding to a point which was taken from a website, which took it from a thread (from which it was deleted) which was about trans rights in general on an abortion group's facebook.

It wasn't at any point responding to the issue of trans men and abortion.

There is a link to NARAL's facebook page, where they shared an article about using gender-inclusive language in abortion services. The article in question is here.

Is the link to the original article on the page stardustlady linked to?

Stardustlady. Let's take one of the comments on that page as an example:

"Apparently women aren't important enough for even The National Abortion Rights Action League to focus on anymore.: Transwomen do not have pregnancies or abortions. And their rights are not under attack."

Trans women do not see themselves as men. When NARAL say that even men must have access to abortions, how are they accommodating trans women?

Trans men have female biology. They may get pregnant and may need access to abortion. Do you deny that? Do you think that a person who identifies as a man, but has female sexual organs can't get pregnant because men don't get pregnant?

All the women need to boycott the event. It's not fair.

This is encouraging - women standing up to a pro choice organisation falling over themselves to be trans inclusive

m.facebook.com/notes/nikki-craft/naral-pro-choice-oregon-censoring-critics-and-selling-out-women/233814927001960/

I agree. Women have GOT to start standing up to this.

Yes, I agree VestalVirgin. Not saying it won't happen, just saying it's not currently the case. I know organisations working in the realm of reproductive rights have been coming under increasing pressure here to use the language of "people with wombs", "pregnant people" etc. AFAIK, most organisations are managing to resist the pressure to erase women but I'm sure some will cave in at some point.

Women participants are going to have to start boycotting ever single event where an "I feels I am a woman" male takes part. Then he/she can be the only one taking part. That is the only thing that will force organisations, sponsors etc. to realise what a stupid silly position they are putting themselves in. Oh and perhaps links like these should be forwarded to Maria Miller.

And another man steals victory from a woman, this time in cycling.

gendertrender.wordpress.com/2015/07/12/mountain-bike-groundhog-day-as-male-rider-sylvia-castaneda-sweeps-womens-division-of-vittoria-eastern-states-cup/

I think that a professional body for midwives in the US has started talking about "people" giving birth rather than "women". That's not happening at all in UK

... yet.

It is being done, and unless there are some significant changes in people's readiness to cater to trans rather than respect women, it will spread.