Annoyed and I want to complain...

I work very hard to ensure girls are encouraged to follow STEM subjects beyond GCSE.

Well, let us admit the hypothesis that bookielookie is the fabulous, non-sexist man. In which case, this discussion isn't about him but the 99.9999% of men who aren't so perfect, so he should just let us talk about those and stop interrupting and trying to join a conversation that isn't about him......................

Or not..............

Or he could just continue his sterling job of providing the perfect example of male entitlement and all those things that don't happen to him 'cos he is male, hence he cannot believe exist.

Like random (male) strangers in the street who feel obliged to offer comments and advice on your facial expressions, obviously just out of purely humanitarian motives and some belief that we'll get stuck that way if the wind changes...........

Man interrupts conversation amongst women and makes it all about him.

If only there were a phenomenon to describe that...

In that article you'd do well to read this bit and boys should be taught to respect other people's contributions to conversations.*

I'm a teacher, that's exactly what I do everyday. I work very hard to ensure girls are encouraged to follow STEM subjects beyond GCSE.

What do you do?

Good link, Lumpy and yes, we should absolutely be arming our daughters with the knowledge that some bad behaviour is overwhelmingly gendered, that the impact of sexist behaviour is not diminished by the fact that other, sometimes similar, forms of bad behaviour exist which affect both sexes, and that women have the right to challenge being treated poorly because they are women, even if this makes people who hadn't spotted the gendered nature of the phenomenon uncomfortable. Talking about how to do that is very valuable. Unfortunately one reason why women find it hard to challenge sexism is the expectation of the sudden escalation to an aggressive response which is all too often encountered.

Can we please work on the basis that mansplaining is real and ignore derailers completely?

YANBU to be annoyed. I would complain to the hotel.

My only addition is that women are just as capable as men at riding over what is being said. And I say that because that is my professional experience

This is simply not true. There is a difference, an observable difference in the way men and women are listened to and how their input is valued. Men are considered to know more on a subject even when less qualified than a woman. Women are considered to be monopolising meetings even when they talk less than the men.

But your professional experience is of your management team talking over you. Not the housekeeper.

In my deleted message, I acknowledged that Mrs TP had a crap experience.

My only addition is that women are just as capable as men at riding over what is being said. And I say that because that is my professional experience.

How (please explain) does this demonstrate precisely what the OP was talking about. ?

(Mrs TP I have always admired and enjoyed your previous posts)

booklooker,

You are demonstrating precisely what the OP was talking about.

You know that, right?

tell women on a feminism thread to fuck off and basically call them stupid.

*I did not call anyone stupid

*A person told me how to raise my daughters, I did not ask for that advice.

*I do not understand why the fact that this is a feminism thread means that I should not be able to share my opinion

Wow! My first time to be deleted: After a complete stranger tells me and my wife how to raise my daughters.

Would none of the rest of you not be a little irate over that?

Probably because it was completely obvious to all of us which subset of men was being referred to and padding the post with caveats to spare the feelings of people looking in who for some reason took it personally is a totally unnecessary derailment. Women are very used to being treated as inferior and ignorant because of our sex. You'd do your daughters a huge favour by paying attention to examples of this kind of shitty behaviour that they are going to face in their adult lives so that when they complain about it to you, you don't feel the need to minimise the experience and talk all over them demanding they state that not all men are like that before they're allowed to talk about how being treated as if they couldn't possibly know anything important because they're 'just' women makes them feel.

Yes, MrsTerry, you were completely right to be so annoyed.

Why not?

The subsequent replies are because the vast majority of us have experienced this, it is part of our lives and it needs naming so it can be dealt with.

Not all men talk over women, some women talk over men but experience has shown us that it is far, far, far more likely that man will (unfettered by his own ignorance in relation to the woman talking) decide he is the one who should be listened to.

We are not going to start qualifying our discussions with 'not all men' when we are posting in a feminism section of a website.

I'm going to go out on a limb and take a wild guess that the poster who popped onto a thread in feminism chat to tell all the women they are wrong about the phenomenon of mansplaining (with a side order of the dreadfulness of a female management team).............is a man.

Bang to rights, you got me there missus. It's a fair cop and I confess that I am a bloke.

I am also over 55
I am also a father to two fantastic teen daughters
I am also a teacher
I am also a Labour voter
I am also white British
I am also an admirer of the OP's posts elsewhere.

Which into which one of those compartments would you best like to put me? Which is the important one for you when you judge?

The OP's first post described an awful intervention by a very unprofessional member of the hotel staff, my impression from the subsequent replies was that 'this is what men do' because they 'mansplain'.

It's not nec because they are men, just that they have too little empathy and tact, but too much self righteousness. They are also grown up bullies.

I do not draw any conclusions upon all females

Well, booklooker, you've successfully derailed the thread and then run away from the question about yourself. Ho hum.

What is the significance of your comment quoted above? Are you under the impression that people who use the term "mansplain" draw conclusions about all men?

I'm going to go out on a limb and take a wild guess that the poster who popped onto a thread in feminism chat to tell all the women they are wrong about the phenomenon of mansplaining (with a side order of the dreadfulness of a female management team)...

..........is a man.

With a self-awareness deficiency.

Amiright?

"mansplain is a really nasty and sexist term."

Mansplain is a really nasty and sexist act.

HTH.