I'm giving up.

The link in my previous post might not have been the best example. I used it based on my points of media influence and whilst it might not have been articulated well by the petitioner I think there were some good points about inappropriate content as I believe this has helped us become desensitised to a lot actually.

This petition is still active and is another example of my points of our education system. I have signed, please share:

www.change.org/p/add-more-female-thinkers-to-the-politics-a-level-syllabus

Also, out of interest crazycatdad what are the more cancerous issues, in your opinion, in our society?

Olivia - re "the big issue here, that being: why feminism is increasingly unpopular?"

Any stats to back that up?

Quite the contrary, feminism is increasingly popular at least here on MN. Many of us (e.g. yours truly) would not have thought of themselves as feminists until their eyes were opened on threads such as this one.

CrazyCatDad You're right, it's not directly linked to feminism (although to me, feminism is about humanity in general as that is always indirectly linked to women) but an example of an individual taking action on something they deemed wrong/unfair. I should have made that clear.

Peyia, are you sure that link is the petition you meant? Stop Inappropriate Social Media Content?

I don't see how it relates to feminism, or lack of awareness. To be honest, even if I had been aware of it, I still wouldn't have signed it because there are few things more cancerous in our society today than censorship on grounds of perceived offence.

Sorry to ruin the party VestalVirgin. Is this thread only open to those who share your views then?

Yes It's a subject that I have a stake in and interests me, so I'm apt to contribute. Sorry that's public forums for you Freshwater..

The latest poll I saw 70% of women rejected the term. So what's going wrong I'm wondering? . They're cant all be just complacent air heads who dont know their born, and need saving from themselves. by the intellectually 'higher born'?
I believe it because feminism today is perceived in the popular mind as a lot of hard line, left-wing , male-bashing, eccentrics, high on grievance and victimology.

Pro -porn and prostitution ? Not necessarily, but something needs to be done so that women here in the U.K can feel that feminism represents them. I believe we need both the radical and the moderate schools of thought. Things and people work best when they put their minds together, but sadly today the moderate voices get shouted down, get called trolls and told to piss off and find another thread etc etc... All we seem to have is the eccentrics being rude to those who disagree with them. meanwhile its feminism itself that suffering.

I think social media is a major part of the problem. It's mainly used by young people who are bombarded by images and opinions that can be shared instantly - the meme I mentioned was put on the page by a man for a wind up but it was almost immediately shared and liked dozens of times. Then the opinions started to come in and within minutes there are half a dozen furious debates going on. The post got deleted eventually but the ideas that might not have even occurred to some people were out there, people who shared opinions (on both sides of the debate) could identify each other.
The offensive JK type idea that came from one pic was seen by hundreds of people in about an hour due to one social media site.

Grimbletart and others, I do see where you are coming from but as I asked in my PP and I think some others have said also - Why are the younger generation's behaviour to blame when we live in a society warped by stardom, looks, money and sex?

Something has gone wrong and the younger generation don't know any better. I never learnt anything about women's rights and the struggle in school and I'm 30. I'm not suprised the younger are oblivious. I was fortunate to be raised by two lesbians who always pointed out inequalities but were careful not to tar all men with the same brush because actually there are a large proportion of men that are raised correctly.

The media are perpetuating this unhealthy image of women and unfortunately many of our younger people do not have parents like you or Garlick.

Surely our energy should be focused on media outlets and not being frustrated at the ignorant. They need pity (and teaching!)

An example of someone trying to make a change at the following link:

petition.parliament.uk/archived/petitions/66641

The deadline had passed and the amount of signatures are pitiful. Social media is a powerful tool, perhaps change of how the media portray women and men is possible, if enough people petitioned.

Having recently had a short argument with a young woman on FB recently I feel a bit the same as the OP...
It was about a really awful meme that was posted on a local board about single mothers (I think there was a post on AIBU at about the same time showing it). Her premise was that single mothers were at fault for - and I quote "getting themselves pregnant".
I'm not an argumentative type really but it got my back up and I challenged her. Her reply was basically that as feminism has given women the pill, women have more contraception choices and therefore the man cannot be held responsible for any pregnancy. This is a young woman in her early twenties with a child of her own. There were other posters liking her comments, mostly women. I tried to argue the point, gave up in the end.
I'm 40, raised by feminist parents, I work from home raising boys and girls and I swear my 4 year old has more of a basic grasp of equality than some adults.

Oh, I forgot. I have never had a feminist make me feel small for my choices in life. I am not currently living in a way that is compatible with my feminist beliefs (not working), and it's tough, but the only person being hard on me about that is me.

I have no idea where these mythical dragon feminists who tear the heads off SAHMs are. Not here.

For something you hold to be so boring and wrong and unpopular, you do seem to find feminism very inspiring, Olivia. You're all over the feminist board. Careful, you might catch it!

On this thread, though, I think you need to stop. Grown ups are talking. Shoosh now.

OP, I totally know what you mean about the tiredness of the fight. I hope you feel re-energised soon, we are far from done and there's loads still to achieve and celebrate.

I don't know Micah - I find myself hesitating over all that a bit. And I find the general view on MN to tend towards encouraging individuality in our dds and not giving in to the prettifying, princessification or 'sexualised' dressing of young girls

. Dd (10) is a fully paid-up member of the geek squad - both in style and interests. I have gently encouraged her natural tendencies in that direction, partly because the sight of some of her peers in make-up and revealing clothes gives me the heebie-jeebies. But then I question my motives - surely judging them on their appearance makes me just as bad as those who would negatively judge dd on hers? Sorting out what makes them dress that way or to what extent it is their own real choice seems a bit tricky. And I do worry about dd being bullied for being different when she starts secondary school. I clearly have a lot still to learn from the feminist boards.

olivia, feminism isn't some club that wants to have as many members as possible. Feminism is a political movement that has goals.

It would be idiotic for feminism to become more pro-porn and pro-prostitution and whatever in order to become more popular.

This is really basic, and really obvious, and in fact, if you continue to write such ignorant nonsense, I will feel tempted to report you as troll. I have no idea what, as a patriarchy-denier, you are even doing in the feminist forums on here.

It's about as nonsensical as coming to a Greenpeace meeting to try and convince people that man-made climate change is a myth ... or rather, that man-made pollution, climate change, nuclear catastrophes and the extinction of animals are all invented and Greenpeace should promote the notion that extinct animal species all committed suicide, in order to become more popular and gain more members.

Seriously. Why are you even here?

Olivia do you see it as a 'total myth' that up until the mid 20th century every single government in the world was run almost entirely by men?

Olivia, Ive recently had a male client ask to have his main customer service manager a bloke. (Don't want to out myself but that's the basic set up) I admit I haven't come across many issues in the work place but that doesn't mean they don't exist.

He seriously thinks a man will do a better job.

To a pp who talks about motherhood, reproduction etc bring central to feminism, yes, that's probably why I feel it would be nice to have a coherent childfree movement.

No, Buffy I see it as a total myth that alienates far more women than it appeals to. I think we're not really debating the big issue here, that being: why feminism is increasingly unpopular?

Olivia - nobody is claiming that no women achieve great things. But the persistence of deeply-ingrained sexist assumptions about women mean that it is still harder for women to achieve many of those things than it is for men. To deny that is naive or wilfully obtuse. Feminists want a level playing-field. Who wouldn't?

No blame on young women from me about sexism per se. But I do put a certain amount of blame on those who are not prepared to be unpopular enough to e.g. say 'no' to unwanted types of sex or to call bollocks on all this "I'm a woman - though actually I'm a bloke in a frock", or call themselves that totally unnecessary invented meaningless word "cis", thus denigrating the meaning of the word woman etc. Maybe they just want to take an easy path, maybe they just want to be popular, maybe they need to be liked or thought not to be "on the wrong side of history" as one mansplainer tried to tell us.

It's just makes me think, why did I bother to fight for our rights, why was I prepared to make myself unpopular with bosses, boys, whatever…do whatever it takes to drag society into the modern era, only to confronted by compliance and timidity.

I am so with you Garlick

I'm with you o/p.

We've actually gone backwards wrt to gender roles. It's natural for girls to like pink and be nurturing. Boys are naturally more physical and aggressive. Bollocks.

It's also the media- it's all about looks, about being pretty, hot, sexy. That's what girls aspire to these days. The old stereotype of the nerdy girl in glasses and dungarees who is given a makeover, is suddenly pretty and has the football star fall in love with her.

Also this fear of being different- don't let you child stand out in case they're bullied. The attitude, even on here, that making your child conform is protecting her from bullies, let someone else make the stand and take the risk. Pluck eyebrows, shave arms in primary school rather than risk being a target.

Olivia.

Just because you lack the ability to understand something, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Sorry.

It might be nice if you could extract capita from rectum long enough to understand that this is supposed to be a supportive thread, not a vehicle for you to endlessly demonstrate your inability to comprehend simple words. If you feel incapable of being supportive to a fellow human being who is in obvious distress, it might be kinder for you to troll a different thread. Thanks.

Olivia, glad you are satisfied with 'plenty' but can you not see how some women would prefer 'an equal amount'?

If you think that your experience means that everything is rosy for women of all walks of life, I can only suggest you broaden your horizons.

Absolutely, its total crap.. Achievement is what counts and women have and continue to achieve plenty. I dont see myself my women friends or either of my DD's as victims subordinate to "The Patriarchy", I think it's quite infantile actually