We need to talk about reproductive coercion.

Oh skirt, that's horrible.

Bloody hell Iwas

When I write it down I feel a bit , but at the time I was more shocked than anything.

A partner pulled out my IUD. I think he'd actually planned it.

Any poster who suggests just going off the pill secretly is roundly jumped on by many posters straight after.

Pearlylum I've never seen a single thread on this forum where a woman has been advised to stop the pill and get pregnant if she wants a child when her partner doesn't. I can believe that there must be the occasional individual idiot poster who says that, but it's vanishingly rare if so. To be fair, in real life when I wanted a kid I was told 'just get pregnant' by many people, male and female. (I didn't.)

If I wanted to force a partner into pregnancy I wouldn't google 'reproductive coercion' I would google 'how many holes in a condom to get pregnant.'

Agree that this is the most fundamental attack on women's autonomy.

I have a link on the relationship between domestic violence and unintended pregnancy:

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15590382

We can safely assume that the higher number of unwanted pregnancies in women whose male partners are violent, is due to reproductive coercion.

Since reproductive coercion is also done by men who are not (yet) otherwise abusive, the actual numbers are likely much higher.

pearlylum Forgive me but I don't see how it's frequency is at all an effective rebuttal of what you quoted from my post. I merely pointed out how any comparison between my situation and were a woman to be in the same boat isn't an accurate comparison because of the additional physical risks.

If you assert its not that common I would hope it's not for either gender, but I don't have any facts on the matter either way. If you've got any data please share it to add to the discussion. If not its just a matter of your opinion.

I agree with MoggyP that the google result shouldn't be given too much weight as an indicator of frequency; women might be googling to ensure it doesn't happen to them, say.

Regardless of that, though, this is a serious issue. And of course, thousands of women a year are victims of rape, in many cases the rapist will be utterly indifferent to the pregnancy risk.

"I would however suggest that reproductive coercion of women , however disgusting is very rare."

nymag.com/thecut/2013/05/when-men-sabotage-birth-control.html

Research reported here gives figures of 15% across socioeconomic groups. Hardly rare then.

Oops last sentence a bit jumbled, but you get the gist

There is a current thread on MN where this subject is at it's very heart.

We cannot ignore the fact that once women are pregnant/under the cosh of early years childcare that socially more often falls to her she is very, very vulnerable

Some abusive men use this to their advantage. I this have seen many instances of this, so I do not agree it is rare

I would however suggest that reproductive coercion of women , however disgusting is very rare.

You mean to say, reproductive coercion BY women, do you?

Because reproductive coercion BY men, done TO women, is par of the course for many countries, so common no one even talks about it, and judging from the threads on mumsnet, MEN DO THIS VERY VERY OFTEN IN THE UK.

dervel your concern is understandable.
*However it's in no way a fair direct comparison for a multitude of reasons. Mainly I didn't have to face the physicality of a pregnancy which takes a physical toll up to and including death.

Its very kind of you to consider how us men get shat on by the occasional woman, and I don't think anyone would deny that, but please don't in my name shut down discussion on systemic and cultural biases that disadvantage women. Any discussion that doesn't place the biological and physical strains placed on women front and center misses the point imho.

I would however suggest that reproductive coercion of women , however disgusting is very rare.

"It is absolutely horrifying. And to see the phrase i mentioned in my OP as a top search term i was stunned. It must be being searched for hundreds of times."

That's not necessarily the case, because it looks at both the terms being searched for, how well they fit what it 'reads' of the sites and then ranks by things such as how well linked the site is, or if it has paid to return a higher placing. And how many people click on the returned links.

Did you? Because that would gave confirmed its placing.

It is an unsound assumption that those who look at a particular page are this who wish to tamper. It might be people like the MNetters you might have just encouraged to search and then look. Or people conducting research. Or campaigners. Or people who fear they may be a victim.

Or women who wish to disguise an 'accident' well (there are enough posts even on MN - a site with many posters who recommend straight dealing - who suggest this)

Yes, highlight a issue, but no, don't make search engine result a central point in your argumentation.

Yes, it's abhorrent to intentionally sabotage birth control, but also fundamentally different when that sabotage puts someone's life at risk rather than your own!

No it's not the same, and I say that as a man currently raising a little boy as a direct result of being flat out lied to about birth control. It is without a doubt the most anxiety inducing, and unpleasant thing anyone has ever done to me, and I'll no doubt have to deal with the legacy of that for both my child and myself.

However it's in no way a fair direct comparison for a multitude of reasons. Mainly I didn't have to face the physicality of a pregnancy which takes a physical toll up to and including death.

Its very kind of you to consider how us men get shat on by the occasional woman, and I don't think anyone would deny that, but please don't in my name shut down discussion on systemic and cultural biases that disadvantage women. Any discussion that doesn't place the biological and physical strains placed on women front and center misses the point imho.

But I have read threads on here where a woman wants more children and her OH doesn't being given the advice to get pregnant by "accident" by stopping the pill.
It works both ways.

Men pull out womens IUDs

Those are horrible and shocking stats Helena.

DW's ex was like this trying to talk her into getting pregnant (even though later she found he was cheating on her etc).

But then again this could present at the start of the spectrum on wanting a certain gendered child. Family friend has had several children previously and doesn't want anymore but partner 'jokes' they will get them drunk to get a boy.

Can anybody PM me with a link to the fred?

There's one in Relationships where I was the first to posit that the OP's pregnancy wasn't as accidental as all that. Since I read a comment a whole back about a guy who deliberately removes condoms, it's been plaguing my kind.

And that's just condoms. I'm even more horrified by the concept of abusers tampering with the pill. FFS.

Yy Lonny