Do you LOVE Zara Larsson too?

So far as the abortion quote I think those of you who think she is wonderful are guilty of pretty selective reading too.

The parts you are relying on to qualify her flippant statement are indeed merely qualifiers. She's set out her principal stance -it's fine to treat abortion as just another means of contraception; might not be the best approach, but fine by her.

Her comparison of a feotus with a mushroom is beyond stupidity.

and the reason i don't buy your interpretation phil is because she implies that even though she might not think it's a good idea, if you "wanna" it's OK.

So repeating something that I don't accept 3 times, way to go !

It's fairly obvious that i meant that a women who wants abortion as contraception as a lifestyle choice should pay for it, but queen phil, rejector of selective quotation will no doubt be along to tell you that in a moment !

One more thing - this:

Barefoot did you have anything to add or did you just want to stick up for your chum ?

is an absolute classic. Barefoot and I have not interacted once before this thread. Do you always categorise people who agree with each other and not you as 'sticking up for their chums'?

Another A debating technique there.

Certainly, itll. Here:

I agree with most of it apart from the bit about abortion, unless the woman in question is willing to pay for the procedures herself that is

Contradicts

nor did i state that a woman should have to pay for her abortions

Oh, and AFAIK I've never encountered Phil before, so I wouldn't call her a chum, though she seems perfectly lovely.

HTH.

Not my interpretation of 'if she want fuck around every month and have an abortion then so it be", but you seem to have a habit of only seeing what you want.

Ha! Ahahahahaha! That is too much. I saw that bit. I addressed that bit. You are the one who refuses to see the next bit. You know, the bit right after where SHE SAYS IT'S NOT A GOOD IDEA AND PEOPLE SHOULD TALK ABOUT BIRTH CONTROL MORE. Sorry for shouting but I have said that three times now and you have ignored it each time.

I give up. Congratulations. You have defeated me with your resolute avoidance of all logical debate. Very well done. Have a .

And although I am in favour of abortion, there is a moral dimension to repeatedly terminating healthy foetuses, it isn't just about the immediate monetary cost.

Noone is promoting abortion as contraception

Not my interpretation of 'if she want fuck around every month and have an abortion then so it be", but you seem to have a habit of only seeing what you want.

And you are wrong that it is no ones business but the woman's. Logically (since you are big on that) a society has to decide whether it thinks offering free and on demand abortion to all women as part of a national health service is a choice it wants to make, and logically other professionals who are engaged by a national body are required to be trained and paid to provide that service, so why you think that it is an entitlement and no one has any business discussing defeats me. I do not want to see that service abused by what i read as encouragement that it is just dandy to have an abortion every month if you feel like it.

Barefoot did you have anything to add or did you just want to stick up for your chum ? Perhaps you could show how I "misrepresented myself" ?

Her ouevre hasn't troubled the 6music playlist unfortunately...

I'll have you know I'm never regularly mistaken for a member of the 18-24 demographic due to my radiant youthfulness and general down-with-the-kids demeanor...

It's quite common for posters to misrepresent what other posters said. It's less common for them to misrepresent themselves.

You've achieved it though, itll. Well done!

I'm very sorry for the MASSIVE derail OP. In a belated reply to your post, she seems like she's got some great opinions and feelings on feministy matters. I can't say her writing style appeals particularly, but then I'm not her target audience I guess. I also have no idea who she is , but great if she's getting girls and young women interested in talking about feminism.

Oh FGS. Noone is promoting abortion as contraception. As GreenTomatoJam said, she used an extreme example to demonstrate that it's nobody's business but the woman's, and then in the very next sentence says it's not the best option, and there should be more talk about birth control.

And you were the one that suggested in your first post that the woman should be paying if she wanted multiple abortions. And followed that up with concerns about the cost of recruiting and training surgeons! And every time I challenge you on the logic of your points, you swerve off to talk about irresponsibility. It's very frustrating.

I feel like I am being forced back to that point because you keep pushing on it, I also feel like I am repeating myself, i don't think that the public paying for abortions is an outrage at all. The real issue, and the one I initially commented on, is that it is irresponsible to promote abortion as a contraceptive in the first place. It is irresponsible for many reasons, cost is indeed one of them, as is the entitlement and expectation it encourages.

Do you agree that it is irresponsible ?

the "hoe" post is not Zara's feelings on the matter...the next two refute it

I feel like I'm repeating myself, but...

No one should make choices that put them in a situation they do not want to be in, unless they have a surefire way of getting out of that situation.

Noone should, but they do. So, once you're faced with the reality of a woman who has previously had 3/4/5 abortions, however many you feel are acceptable, but is pregnant again and wants an abortion, which you now feel is a 'lifestyle choice' and unacceptable, the public will have to either 'pick up the bill' for the abortion, or 'pick up the bill' for the pregnancy and birth.

The pregnancy and birth is more expensive than the abortion, so don't you think the public would rather pick up the bill for the abortion?

There is a whole other discussion to be had about the best way to enable a woman to avoid needing multiple abortions, but you keep coming back to the outrage that the public has to pay for them, so I wanted to address that point.

The first one about not being a "hoe" is nothing to be admired.

The 'have an abortion every month" is flippant and irresponsible.

How have I tied myself in knots !?

It'll, once again you've tied yourself in knots then been rude about the intellectual ability of those disagreeing with you.

Well, I'm not sure why you think my thoughts are tangled, but I'll try this. No one should make choices that put them in a situation they do not want to be in, unless they have a surefire way of getting out of that situation. Not having the means to get out of situation you got yourself into is not the same thing as being "forced" to do something you don't want. Being wealthy buys you access to many such ways, i don't think this is fair, but it is how it is. If you are going assume that the public will pick up the bill for all your choices, then you shouldn't.

They weren't rhetorical questions, I was hoping you'd answer them.

However, I've got stuff to do now. Will be back this evening if you've managed to untangle your thoughts by then.

Casting passive aggressive aspersions on quality of thinking right back atcha

You are continually asking rhetorical questions which I think are to support the position that women should be able to use abortion as if it were a contraceptive and no one should have any problem with that, but I'm not sure.

Is that a cost effective solution to the problem?

I don't understand now. What is your position, are you arguing that abortion on demand as lifestyle choice is a fine thing, and that the threads subject was perfectly reasonable in implying it was ? What is the problem ?

So, abortion on demand as a 'lifestyle choice' is not a great choice, and you think that if a woman wants that she should pay for it, but what if the woman can't pay for it? Is she then forced to carry the baby to term? Is that good thing? Is that a cost effective solution to the problem?

You represented my comments as saying that all women should be expected to pay for any abortion, then argued against that. No I didn't. I have been debating in the context of the thread, about abortion on demand and 'abortion used as a contraceptive'.

And also - 'hard of thinking' - nice.

Unless you are hard of thinking it is pretty obvious that I am arguing that it is wrong to expect that abortion on demand as a lifestyle choice is something that women should expect (leaving aside the fact that IME people would not make that choice). If someone wants abortion on tap as a lifestyle choice then THEY ought to pay for it.

You represented my comments as saying that all women should be expected to pay for any abortion, then argued against that. That is a straw man.

The attitude that I am entitled to an abortion exactly when I want it isn't healthy. Why should i be ? Why should anyone be ? For your benefit this position is not the same as saying that everyone must pay for their own abortions. I hope this clarifies.