Young dependent male children in women's only spaces?

How does unisex changing areas work re showers? I have not been near a public swimming pool for decades.

So far as refuges what is the mother of a teenage boy meant to do? Leave him behind?

" don't know, most offences are not reported. Most that are reported wouldn't then be widely reported in the media."

So how many have you come across in the course of your work, then?

Just as a point of information, in case anyone isn't clear, a "radical" feminist not an "extreme" feminist. The "radical" just means that we think that the current societal structures need to be changed before things can get better for both women and men.

And no TheHoneyBadger the problem is at women's door. Women, mothers or otherwise are being told on this thread that their feelings don't matter and they should accept feeling uncomfortable because the alternative is much worse.

Yes the solution to this is for swimming pools to get refurbished so they have unisex cubicle changing areas.

Perhaps these 'rad fems' described in the OP are objecting to the attitude that women should just suck it up. Again. As usual.

Perhaps the OP could clarify?

such an easily solveable issue if leisure centres would just have unisex changing rooms with cubicles, then noone needs to concern themselves with whatever sex, gender, identity of other people who just want to go swimming.

My local leisure centre has unisex changing rooms, with loads of cubicles and a main area if you dont care about privacy.
I wouldnt send my young boy into a mens changing room without me. Hes much more at risk in there than any women would be from a small boy child

Reading this I'm so glad we have a decent setup at our local pool; unisex cubicles with a few larger family ones. Our eldest is 9 (looks 11) and still needs that extra level of supervision, but you wouldn't know to look at him. I'm not quite sure what we'd do if it was just me taking him for a swim with separate changing rooms. It wouldn't necessarily be the safety of the male changing rooms but his own hidden disabilities that would be the issue.

At the same time, it would never have occurred to use the disabled facilities as he is physically able, and his lessons are at the same time as a wheelchair bound swimmer often goes so I'm quite conscious of their overriding needs.

It sounds like it comes down to provision of family rooms or unisex areas alot of the time, is this something people have found at specific pools, council or private ones? Who would be the best people to contact about this?

I said that's what I would do, honey

Swimming is an optional leisure activity. Needing to go a bit further for a year to a pool with family changing, or to only go when you have another male adult/older child with you, or to just let your child go into the men's and ask a staff member to check on him if he's taking a while... Is hardly comparable to Afghanistan!

at mothers feet more accurately scallops.

*men's

I am probably considered a rad fem here. I have two boys. Can we stop with the insults please.

The choice being presented between women just needing to suck their feelings of being uncomfortable because me changing spaces are dangerous for boys and women restricting their movements because they have sons are equally patriarchal. The root of the problem isn't adressed and the burden of sorting it out is at women's feet.

there's a post on here essentially proposing mothers of boys who don't have a adult male escort shouldn't go swimming for a year or so or until their son is capable and confident of going alone into male changing rooms.

ergo women without males should have less freedom of movement than married/fathered/etc ones?

afghanistan springs to mind.

How many cases of sexual assault have taken place in the changing rooms of swimming pools in the UK in the last 12 months?

I don't know, most offences are not reported. Most that are reported wouldn't then be widely reported in the media.

As I've said previously, the risk is undoubtedly lower than I perceive it, due to the work that I do. However, the risk is definitely there, and it's not one I'm willing to take. Boys should not be put at risk of sexual assault to avoid offending adult females. I've also previously said that I don't think boys should be unaccompanied in female changing rooms/toilets - they should be with their mother/female carer. Of course, ideally they would be in a cubicle rather than a communal space. It's not about "boys being more important than girls" - I do not think that at all. It's about someone's right not be sexually abused being more important than someone else's right to a "perfect", all female space.

DrSeuss, yes, statistically, the risk of being abused by someone you know is higher than a stranger assault. It's a separate issue that I would also take precautions with.

I don't remember reading about any such incidents, Elizabeth, but no doubt there have been a few.

Sadly, there's a higher statistical risk from family, friends and neighbours. Do you also suggest not leaving your 8 year old with one of your cousins or friends?

"Male changing rooms in themselves are not dangerous places for boys to go into. However, there are dangerous men out there who, given the opportunity, will commit sexual offences against children. Unaccompanied young children, getting changed in a public space, are easy prey. It's not urban mythology, it's a fact."

How many cases of sexual assault have taken place in the changing rooms of swimming pools in the UK in the last 12 months?

"It's attitudes like this that have many women and girls declaring that they're not feminists. I don't think radical feminists help feminism in any way, shape or form. Seriously, what do they do if and when they give birth to a dreaded boy child?"

No radical feminist ever has had a problem with baby boys.

There are a few batshit crazy separatist feminists who do. Bit ascribing their views to radical -or any other sort of feminist- is a bit like saying vegetarians are the same as the sort of animal rights activists that send letter bombs to scientists.

Male changing rooms in themselves are not dangerous places for boys to go into. However, there are dangerous men out there who, given the opportunity, will commit sexual offences against children. Unaccompanied young children, getting changed in a public space, are easy prey. It's not urban mythology, it's a fact.

" I don't think radical feminists help feminism in any way, shape or form. Seriously, what do they do if and when they give birth to a dreaded boy child?"

Read my prior posts.

"What pisses me off is that the problem is the unsafe nature (perceived or real) of male only changing spaces, yet the discussion isn't about how men allowed those spaces to become so toxic, or why men are doing fuck all about it. It's all about how women of all ages have to deal with the fallout from it."

In most circumstances I would agree with you. It pisses me off that women generally have to adapt to accommodate men. But in this particular case, I'm not actually sure what men could do to counter the idea that male changing rooms are dangerous places for boys to go into. They obviously aren't- but it is a powerful bit of self perpetuating urban mythology.

It's attitudes like this that have many women and girls declaring that they're not feminists. I don't think radical feminists help feminism in any way, shape or form. Seriously, what do they do if and when they give birth to a dreaded boy child?

Meh smilie fail

Small children I don't mind what gender they are, honestly. However I think that by 7-8 they should be able to sort themselves out. I am all for "family" based changing rooms. Personally I am actually uncomfortable changing in front of anybody, so I change in the toilet , but obviously I have to shower etc in the main area.

I didn't mean all radfems justt "those* radfems {grin} @ eating boy babies

My replies were to Madeline and mrsj

There is a big difference between rad fems and seperatists!

Why are people implying I said rad fem when I didn't?

I don't consider seperatists feminists at all.