Islamaphobia?

Science, a belief based on a guess until proven correct, that hasn't got all the answers yet.

In the main they decide which roles are inferior and then allocate them to women.

I believe Sikhism started off on a basis of equality but then veered off down the usual channels.

Sorry Grimbletart.

You and I sing from the same hymn sheet .

I dislike any religion that upholds the patriarchal viewpoint, that includes atheism btw. All seek to promote inequality.

Are there any religions that don't do this?

As a feminist I could not bring myself to subscribe to any organised religion.

They all offend my core belief that men and women are equal. (And no, I don't fall for their equal but different roles crap either).

Some are worse than others but all are unacceptable to me.

vestal can you name a European Christian country that doesn't allow women to drive or travel without her owner/man's permission and will stone her to death for being raped?

I think it's ok to say those are outrageous human rights abuses we all need to fight against, as well as wish we had closed the gender pay gap here and the other equality issues we campaign for in our societies.

Christianity is no picnic for women either, but I can think of plenty of Christian countries where women at least have equal rights in law, and can't think of any Muslim ones (Indonesia maybe?) where women do.

If you were to draw a Venn diagram of misogyny, homophobia, intolerance of alternative beliefs, current terrorist activity and Islam, the overlap would be pretty big.

But it makes you islamophobic to say that. Even if you come from a Muslim country, you were raised as a Muslim and half your family are Muslim, apparently white middle class lefties know better than you do. Would it have been "Catholic-phobic" to criticise the Magdelene laundries, or the protection of paedophiles in the church, or are those perfectly legitimate complaints?

The idea that Goldsmiths LGBT and women's societies have rushed to support the ISOC in shutting down completely legitimate criticism of Islam, is a nonsense.

There's a massive difference between supporting Islam and not giving them shit and treating them differently for their beliefs.

Islamaphobia is for people who are uneducated as far as I'm concerned.

Native UK Muslim populations do appear to be more susceptible to radicalisation than migrant ones:

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/radicalised-muslims-in-uk-more-likely-to-be-well-heeled-9754062.html

Vestal I'm afraid I have to disagree in the strongest possible terms. Not to the lack of safe convictions secured in the US, that as you quite rightly point out out needs addressing everywhere, but in even making the comparison. Under sharia law the woman had actually has no say she is required to bring forward four male witnesses, and if they find against her she automatically guilty of sexual immorality and stoned.

I agree with sentiments that the whole problem may well be cultural, Indonsia is an 87% Muslim nation, with 18% representation of female MPs (not all that far behind the UK. Women make up 51% of the workforce and they have had a female president. So it's obviously possible for Islam to coexist with progressive women's rights movements, however it is distinctly difficult to even ask the question of where the batshittery exists, and anything resembling a reasoned critique without being accused of this or that -ism or -phobia.

My own experience is Irish culture being caught up with religion.

Wasn't there a case in Ireland recently where a woman was killed by the government by denying her an abortion even though the pregnancy threatened her life?

I think it is dangerous to get caught up in blaming Islam. It distracts from the misogyny going on in Christian countries.

Now, for women from Islamic countries, blaming Islam is the way to go, as it is part of the patriarchy they fight.

But to those of us who live in predominantly Christian countries, it is dangerous to look at Islamic countries and pity the women there instead of cleaning our own doorsteps, so to speak.

I am sorry that happened to you OP and it must be difficult to process.

I think no-platforming generally is a very serious problem in itself, while of course death threats are not on, from any source.

My own experience is Irish culture being caught up with religion.

I'm not really sure what it is you are saying.

But I don't find Muslim culture in the UK to be any more sexist than wider UK culture. My perception is that in some areas, it seems to be less sexist. It is generally not Muslim women in the UK who are brought up to believe that women are no good at Science, for example.

And that isn't because I'm particularly PC, silenced or scared of being called a racist.

It just isn't my experience.

Which Christian nation deems a woman's testimony to be worth exactly one quarter of a man's? In which Christian countries are women prohibited from leaving the house if they are not accompanied by a male guardian? Is there any Christian country where women are prohibited from showing their faces in public?

America.

America, where a rape can be filmed and the rapists not be brought to justice. America, where women are raped for leaving the house without a male guardian. America, where men murder women for wanting to divorce them, and get to call it an accident, or just "manslaughter".

America, where a woman's nipple is more offensive than a depiction of violence.

Other patriarchies simply don't make it official how much they hate women. However, to many judges, a female rape victim's word is worth only one quarter (if that) of that of her rapist.

The differences are in degree, not in principle.

Who is telling us to silence our voice against Islam? What are their interests? Are they the same people telling us to silence our voices against the patriarchy?

There is some overlap, I'd wager. Some of the people who rally us to speak out against Islam are very creepy, though.

"onny, I know exactly what you mean, but I have spoken out about Islam and I have been told to silence myself or die."

Who by?

In America, shooting in schools, for a wide variety of equally ridiculous reasons.

That many Christian countries are 1st world, more socially evolved, purportedly more equal, means you are comparing apples with oranges. We have different reasons for our outrages, yet the outcome is often the same.

So where exactly are all these Christians who are shooting schoolgirls for wanting to get an education, stoning women who have been raped, murdering daughters for "dishonouring" the family, throwing acid in the faces of "immodestly" dressed women?

Which Christian nation deems a woman's testimony to be worth exactly one quarter of a man's? In which Christian countries are women prohibited from leaving the house if they are not accompanied by a male guardian? Is there any Christian country where women are prohibited from showing their faces in public?

I am no fan of organised religion. I think in some countries the citizens mix religion and culture.

Actually I am an Islamaphobe inasmuch as the religion as it stands currently terrifies me. I am scared of it. I don't however want to be scared of it. Make of that what you will.

Who is telling us to silence our voice against Islam? What are their interests? Are they the same people telling us to silence our voices against the patriarchy?

And whoever it is, why must we listen?