proposed legislation in scotland - licensed saunas and legalised prostitution

I sincerely hope a trafficking victim never has to encounter you Fran, my orifices aren't raped multiple times a day

Vestal

I don't want another job. Not until I graduate and can hopefully get into a qualified job.

Sapphire We will have to disagree. I don't think "sex work" is just work like any other.

I think the "sex industry " is degrading and debasing and incompatible with human dignity.
I think the idea it is acceptable to hire another person to masturbate into or over is unacceptable and incompatible with a society where everyone is treated with respect.

And then there would be rapey men coming and going at all times of the day and night. Do you have children? If you did would you want your children to walk past these men?

"Normalising prostitution affects all women detrimentally. "

Yup.

Wow? So I suffer from cognitive dissonance now?

This is actually amusing now. What a condescending bunch

I am a prostitute I do in calls and out calls from home see between 3-8 clienta in a shift.

And I'm at uni doing psychology so I'm perfectly capable of making and understanding my choices

Did you reply to the consultation Sapphire?

Do you want brothels popping up all over Scotland? Do you want people from all over England travelling to Scotland to go to one of these legal brothels?

What if a brothel popped up on the same street as yours?

@lass

I am normal. What I do is normal for me. It is different to forced prostitution ?

Playswell that is disgusting. I have known women forced into prostitution, they are certainly not in the same job as me

You're ignorant and I can see why now. No doubt many sex workers have hit a brick wall with you attempting to show you the true nature of UK sex work and the difference between sex work and trafficking

Normalising prostitution affects all women detrimentally.

Normalising prostitution affects detrimentally all women, men and children who discover themselves living next door or even worse, on the same tenement stair , as a brothel. The latter due to the demographics of Scottish city living is the more likely.

OK, I see none of you are capable of accepting reality when it's right in front of you.

Perhaps you get some pleasure from thinking of prostitutes as incapable of making their own choices.
And thinking forced prostitutes are the majority and how noble you all are

I'm just glad that prostitution will not ever be affected by these things. Middle class women throughout history have always assumed poor prossies are incapable of helping themselves or having complete awareness of what they're choosing.

From the last time trafficking and prostitution are not the same.

I don't often agree with Playswell and Vestal but I cannot better their last few posts.

That is a disgusting thing to claim, that I am responsible for any bad clients trafficking victim's may get?

Rapists. The word you are looking for is "rapists". Trafficking victims don't have "clients", nor do they have "bad clients", they have rapists.

Frans1973

Wow! Are you joking? So this is what feminism is?

Claiming there's something wrong with me bcos I allow rapey men to touch me or insisting I'm being paid to give my view?!

No wonder there's a lack of knowledge on this forum if this is how you respond to those of us in or close to these situations you're involving yourselves in.

What a shame

frans... she doesn't care. As long as it doesn't mean she makes less money, other women's suffering is immaterial.

@frans: Has she stated she is a prostitute? I suspect she might do phone sex, as "social anxiety" and actual physical prostitution don't mix too well.

Also, if at all, she is likely a high-class escort. So, you know, only one time a day.

Either that, or cognitive dissonance taking over. Like this:

dilbert.com/strip/1992-08-09

"Are you aware that trafficking and prostitution are completely different?"

Sweden does not agree. They rightly believe (and so do I) that all prostitution is rape and a violent crime against women and children.

Paid rape. It's like raping a woman and then giving her money so she doesn't report it to the police.

It would have been far quicker for you simply to have written:

Nah, couldn't give a fuck about them, because I'm ok.

But we get what you mean.

And please, please don't assume that you have any level of monopoly on knowledge here. You don't. Think I'm done with you and your arrogance now.

"I applaud your fighting for trafficking victim's I'm just saying leave us our of it."

When you say "us", what percentage of prostituted women (and children, and men) do you think you are speaking on behalf of?

That is a disgusting thing to claim, that I am responsible for any bad clients trafficking victim's may get?

I know you think you're coming from a good place but you're understanding is just way off the actual reality of UK sex work.

You wonder why "people like me" ie sex workers give you a hard time on the Internet as you said above, and that's because you are trying to involve yourself in our livelihoods in a warped attempt to help trafficking victim's
.
I applaud your fighting for trafficking victim's I'm just saying leave us our of it.

And just so you know in 5 years touch wood, I have only ever encountered completely ordinary guys, this isn't Hollywood and your good intentions are completely misguided

Surely we can tackle this issue of forced prostitution without trodding on other marginalised groups

I replied to the consultation by Jean Urquhart using very strong words disagreeing with all the proposed reforms and put in strong arguments for the Swedish model.

Here is her reply if anyone is itnerested
-----

Dear ___

Thank you very much for your response to the consultation on the proposed Prostitution Law Reform (Scotland) Bill. The consultation process is absolutely essential for ensuring that the widest range of views, experience and expertise is included in the consideration of new legislation, but it succeeds only when people volunteer their time to contribute to the process. I am deeply grateful that you and so many others have done so.

I am delighted that we have received such a huge diversity of responses from across Scotland, and as far afield as Canada and Namibia. I hoped that the consultation would give people an opportunity to look more critically at this rarely-discussed but highly important issue, and I think it has been successful in that.

The next stage in the process will be for the Scottish Parliament’s officials to analyse the responses and produce a summary. I expect that to be completed by February, and I will write to you again then to send you a copy of that report.

In the meantime, I will be publishing all of the responses on my website prostitutionreform.scot, where you can also find further information about the issue of prostitution law.

Thank you again for taking the time to contribute to this important discussion.

Best wishes,
Jean Urquhart MSP
Highlands and Islands
Tel: 0131 348 5053

Room M3.20
The Scottish Parliament
Edinburgh EH99 1SP

@SapphireStarfish, you said you had choices. So why did you choose a job which involves rapey men buying your body and raping your orfices mulitple times a day??

What is wrong with you??? Are you being paid to say this on here??

They are not the majority of this industry is my point.
And don't make assumptionsure I am more than aware of the situation regarding trafficking.

But you have no knowledgeor experience at all .

Are you aware that trafficking and prostitution are completely different?

Why must you trod on one marginalised group to help another?
Yes I'm very lucky I know that, I just fail to see why you should be against all of the women in the UK just like me.

I see you mentioned social anxiety. I suffer from that, too. However, the solution I propose is a system wherein more jobs are open to people with social anxiety, not one where jobs that negatively impact half of the population are kept legal just because they might suit some people best.

(Also, I am of the opinion that everyone should have enough money to live on without holding a job, but that's utopian and may not happen for a long time.)

I'm glad you feel like that.

I'm glad you chose it.

I'm glad you can decide who, where, when and how much.

I'm less glad that your choosing it has such an impact on women who don't, but hey, as long as you make money, then everything's ace, no?

The vast majority of women don't choose it. Have no choices. But fuck em, eh?

No one wants to take your livelihood away. Why is it that people like you can only ever see how it will affect you and not the vast majority of women forced into prostitution because they have no choices?

Those are the women I'm concerned with, not the tiny minority of women like you who aren't forced by circumstances, social deprivation, addiction, abuse, poverty, lack of opportunity, and on and on to choose prostitution. Are you really this blinkered? Do you really have so little insight into the lives of the women who have no choice but to accept the johns you filter out? The ones that make your spidey senses tingle? The men who don't accept no? Or did you think they just decided not to fuck someone?

Knock yourself out throwing your weight around where I make a living. Have fun. In fact a fair few 1000 people, men and women, would be happy if you did.

And you can't edit once you post on this forum. You have to ask for it to be deleted or stand by your words.

I resent the mindset that women's bodies are for sale (or rent, whatever). Simple as that.
My right to not be seen as a piece of meat overrides your right to work in a particular job of your own choosing.

Also, and more importantly, the right of other women to not be trafficked overrides your right to the job you like most.

I care about women who are forced into prostitution. (I.e. raped). I do not particularly care about people such as myself who are working in a job of their own choosing, and could work in a different job that would maybe slightly less fun.

As things are, the things I am best at might soon be made superfluous by computers. Do you see me protesting on the streets against the development of computer programs?
If my job is made superfluous, I will just have to deal with it. Why should the same not apply to you?