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Original poster

proposed legislation in scotland - licensed saunas and legalised prostitution

409 replies

weeonion · 30/11/2015 12:32

A consultation is currently happening in Scotland to make charges to the laws around prostitution, brothel keeping and pimping. No matter what you think - it would be good to have your voice, experiences and opinions heard in this. They have just extended the deadline to the 8th December so if time has been an issue for you - you now have another week!

Responses prepared electronically should be sent by e-mail to:
[email protected]
Responses prepared in hard copy should be sent by post to:
Jean Urquhart MSP
Room M3.20
Scottish Parliament
Edinburgh
EH99 1SP
You may also contact Jean Urquart’s office by telephone on (0131) 348 5052

OP posts:
SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 12:58

Panic disorders not nice disorders! Really need to figure out editting!

SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 12:56

*advocate against

HirplesWithHaggis · 10/12/2015 12:56

Thank you, weeonion.

SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 12:55

Just because society can do without my job why should you advocate for my job which I have found happiness in to be taken away from me?
I've suffered with anxiety, a nice disorders and social anxieties since around 15 (no I've never been abused in any way, i have a completely close and loving family ) so this job has been a life saver for me

SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 12:52

So xlcan I ask why you want to take away my livelihood I'm which I'm happier than I've ever been in other jobs? I've done this 5 years and I can't tell you enough how much hell I have been through I'm previous jobs. I've done this independentally full time up until moving to part time now I'm at university. How can you say my experience is not real when you have only vague knowledge of this industry nine of which based on any real experience?
I'm not attacking you I hope you can understand, but genuine question how can you muscle in and deny my choices and decisions. Even my family whilst concerned when I first started now are happy for me that I've found my way of working that works for me, I've completely changed and gotten back to my happy self since becoming an independent sex worker

VestalVirgin · 10/12/2015 12:44

I'm fully independent and yes trafficking victim's need help, but imagine if I started throwing my weight around regarding however you make your living, saying it was all wrong and you were incapable of choosing that for yourself.

As I work in a very badly paid job, you are welcome to advocate for cost-free training in a better paid job for me, and for my job being outlawed because it is too badly paid and the working conditions are too bad.

I don't quite see how society could do without people doing my job, but you are welcome to try and convince everyone. Wink

However, as my job does not negatively affect you and your life in any way, I don't think you will be able to work up the motivation to do so.

SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 12:31

But you're not caring about us. You're completely ignoring those of us who legitimately choose to make our living this way.
I'm fully independent and yes trafficking victim's need help, but imagine if I started throwing my weight around regarding however you make your living, saying it was all wrong and you were incapable of choosing that for yourself.

This is so far from protecting sex workers and defending their rights

SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 12:28

That was to playswell. Unsure how to edit

PlaysWellWithOthers · 10/12/2015 12:27

I'm one of those people wee, not so much on here, but definitely on Twitter. Men can get really quite upset and use violent language when they think that they might not be able to use women in this way. Couldn't give a shit what they want, or about their tantrums, ll I care about is the women.

SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 12:26

I don't understand how you can deny the existence of women who freely choose escorting as a job. Trafficking is a completely different matter, surely you can't be (don't mean this offensively but can't think of another way to put it) ignorant enough to ignore actual prostitutes who have direct involvement in the industry when you have no idea what it's actually like, and that this is many women's livelihood you're interfering in without any understanding that trafficking and prostitution are completely different

Original poster
weeonion · 10/12/2015 12:24

Hi sapphire - where do you think play well has done that?

OP posts:
SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 12:21

Playswell, are you not confusing prostitutes with trafficking victim's here

Original poster
weeonion · 10/12/2015 12:13

Playswell - I know of people who experienced a bit of a hounding after "coming out" with their opposition to prostitution. They were 'pursued' around social media by a well known sexwork campaigner and had a tough time.

I wonder if these are the kind of things jean thinks are 'lively discussions'?

OP posts:
PlaysWellWithOthers · 10/12/2015 10:24

Fuck it, couldn't give even the tiniest toss if punters and pimps know that I give more a damn about prostituted women than them. Not going to come as too much of a shock to my work and friends either!

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 10/12/2015 10:07

The difference is the official ones will give anonymity if requested.

Rhoda Grant and Jean Urquhart are giving themselves the opportunity to decide.

If a FOI request was made to an official response information provided would be redacted.

Original poster
weeonion · 10/12/2015 09:49

checked out the Scottish govt site and other consultations.

from the current whistleblower one -

"Handling your response

If you respond using Citizen Space, you will be automatically directed to the Respondent Information Form at the start of the questionnaire. This will let us know how you wish your response to be handled and, in particular, whether you are happy for your response to be made public.

If you are unable to respond via Citizen Space, please complete and return the Respondent Information Form attached at the end of this document as this will ensure that we treat your response appropriately. If you ask for your response not to be published, we will regard it as confidential, and we will treat it accordingly.

All respondents should be aware that the Scottish Government is subject to the provisions of the Freedom of Information (Scotland) Act 2002 and would therefore have to consider any request made to it under the Act for information relating to responses made to this consultation exercise."

but from Rhoda Grant's 2012 consultation document on legislative change

"113. Therefore, if you wish your response, or any part of it, to be treated as anonymous, please state this clearly along with the reasons for this. If I accept the reasons, I will publish it as “anonymous response”. If I do not accept the reasons, I will let you know and give you the option of withdrawing it or submitting it on the normal attributable basis. If your response is accepted as anonymous, it is your responsibility to ensure that the content of does not allow you to be identified."

I think it may be standard text in consultation documents and not something jean or her civil servants have come up by themselves.

OP posts:
Original poster
weeonion · 10/12/2015 09:36

Hirples - I think it is understandable that many people would not want their real name linked with consultation responses - not just those who are / have been involved in prostitution.

Given that certain people are waiting to go through responses, share them on social media and "name and shame" those who disagree with the proposals, I think reticence around giving real names is a form.of self protection.

It has happened in the past, so it is a strong possibility it will happen again.

I wonder how many punters will ask for anonymity or will they be open?

OP posts:
LassWiTheDelicateAir · 10/12/2015 09:03

Why would I want my name and address to be made available to pimps and punters like the one who was on here?

In relation to other consultations my details are not anonymous but my recollection is a request for anonymity, if made, does not have to be justified.

SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 02:20

Really tired, prostitution is legal in the UK. And I can confirm that for many women it's just another day at the office, as far away from the rich high class courtesans as it is from the seedy coerced idea.
Many women including myself do this work having had lots of other jobs before and plenty of other choices
There are many pro's to being a set worker and for myself the cons are significantly lower than I've experienced in previous "regular " jobs

HirplesWithHaggis · 10/12/2015 01:58

It would be reasonable to ask for, and be granted, anonymity if you were/are a former/current sexworker, and were responding within that context.

Being an anonymous poster on a popular website, not really.

It's some time since I read the document, and far too late at night for me to re-read now, but iircc if you ask for anonymity and she says "no", you can simply remove your comments.

She's not forcibly "outing" anyone. Why would you not want to stand by your statements? Either professionally or personally?

SapphireStarfish · 10/12/2015 01:53

For a previous poster requesting sources for UN involvement in trafficking Google the name kathy Bolkovac and than should give you a mass of information to start with

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 10/12/2015 01:35

I see Jean Urquhart will only honour requests for anonymity if reasons are given and she considers the request is reasonable.

I requested anonymity and as a reason mentioned her consultation was discussed here ; the majority of posters do not support her , but the most vociferous supporter was a formerly banned male user of prostitutes. I wonder if that is a good enough reason?

Interestingly I respond both in a professional and personal capacity to official Scottish Government consultations. I don't recall requests for anonymity having to be justified there.

Original poster
weeonion · 08/12/2015 21:30

I wonder why punters who think prostitution is fine / empowering / just another job don't give it a go themselves? It's easy enough to set up an escorting profile and get punters. Granted it is likely to be men who want to pay them for a blow job or penetration which they may not want to do. Just like the majority of women involved but at least they would get the liberating experience of being paid for unwanted sex?Hmm

What do you reckon beaanadie?

OP posts:
OneMoreCasualty · 08/12/2015 20:59
PlaysWellWithOthers · 08/12/2015 20:34

I'd not bother wasting your time, vesuvia, it's the pbp from earlier in the thread, who's finished his little cry-wank and has come back for more.

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