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Original poster

Rape and coercion

106 replies

VampyreQueen · 08/08/2015 21:41

I'm trying to think something through and I'd greatly appreciate some help!

My DP and I were discussing a well known game franchise that he plays. I haven't played it myself so only know the story second hand, if you see what I mean.

Essentially, Character A and Character B are kidnapped by the Bad Guys. The Bad Guy tells A that he has a choice; either A can rape B or he (Bad Guy) will. This is basically a means of torture, in that A must decide wether to take the 'kinder' option of doing it or allowing the Bad Guy to do it (probably with added violence)

To me, A is still a rapist and - though in a shit position - is still morally wrong (if you see what I mean)

DP disagrees. I would be interested in your thoughts, Should you care to share them Smile

OP posts:
YonicScrewdriver · 09/08/2015 19:28

Scallops, that's really clearly put, thanks.

Was A raped? Yes. Who penetrated her without consent ? B. Therefore did B commit rape? Yes.

scallopsrgreat · 09/08/2015 19:23

I think you DH as a lot of people do, looks at rape from the perspective of the perpetrator not the victim. Abuse is often defined by the perpetrators.

I'd be pretty certain A would say she'd been raped by B. A rape took place and B perpetrated it.

Why is he playing this game? Apologies if you've said. I'm not surprised he gets defensive when questioned about it. He bloody should. It is a criticism of him and the game.

Original poster
VampyreQueen · 09/08/2015 14:56

I'm glad he did get caught eventually.

I think PP are right, actually, and that this is just another way of making women's suffering all about the men. Which is sad really and sort of worrying that DP can't see it.

OP posts:
JustTheRightBullets · 09/08/2015 14:47

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
VampyreQueen · 09/08/2015 14:35

Shock That's awful Just! I'm sorry that that happened to you Thanks

OP posts:
JustTheRightBullets · 09/08/2015 14:20

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JustTheRightBullets · 09/08/2015 14:14

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Original poster
VampyreQueen · 09/08/2015 14:11

*apologies for typos. I have fat fingers Grin

OP posts:
Original poster
VampyreQueen · 09/08/2015 14:09

DO does get sort of defense about this and other games.

I wonder if it's because he feels like a criticism of the game Is a criticism of him? E.g., if this game is sexist/misogynistic than I (as a fan of this game) must also be sexist/misogynistic. Since I am not, the game can't be either.

OP posts:
JustTheRightBullets · 09/08/2015 14:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 09/08/2015 14:03

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Original poster
VampyreQueen · 09/08/2015 13:10

Sorry, I've only just caught up with this.

I genuinely started this thread to gather opinions and help me to articulate the issues I had with this game. however, I'm aware it's a less than pleasant subject matter so if people think it's a vile thread or inappropriate I will, of course, delete it/report it. I genuinely don't want to upset anyone.

With regards to the plot being in the game, I agree that it is not a subject to be taken lightly and was possibly thrown in as a quick and easy way to create emotion/drama. I would say that lots of different scenarios are explored - betraying your friends/ saving one life at the expense if another/ wether torture is ever acceptable and so on. I initially saw this plot as an extension of that but perhaps I am wrong. I am certainly uncomfortable with the way players see A and B as equally victims

OP posts:
YonicScrewdriver · 09/08/2015 13:00

Of course I'm not blasé about it as well you know. Any more than MNHQ, who originated We Believe You, despite your aspersions cast at them.

differentnameforthis · 09/08/2015 12:59

Blasé, really? Are we not allowed to discuss in a reasonable manner? Or should we be shouting & screaming at each other?

differentnameforthis · 09/08/2015 12:57

"Settle a debate" really? It's a given there's nothing wrong with the game scenario? Huh?

OP said her & her dp were discussing it & she wanted opinions.

She said yes, it was rape. He said no, it wasn't! They discussed it, couldn't settle it. That's a debate, no?

LassUnparalleled · 09/08/2015 12:56

I'm amazed that you are so blasé about the inclusion of rape scenarios as part of an online game. Given the enormous amount of every day minor things FWR takes exception to.

I'm deregistering. There have been some interesting discussions. I would have expected this thread to have generated a debate about how such a scenario as part of a game is even acceptable, not what has been discussed.

Oh and claiming duress as a defence to commit a crime might mitigate at sentencing. It not a defence.

YonicScrewdriver · 09/08/2015 12:39

And since when did someone's decades old student essay and their tutor's opinion of it (which you actually expressed as " the answer was thought to be no") mean the rest of us should not even consider the question any more, take that as gospel and suffer some dismissive high handedness if we don't?

YonicScrewdriver · 09/08/2015 12:22

Lass, what are you talking about? I haven't googled the game but I'm sure it exists. As it exists, we are discussing it. We often discuss things in mainstream culture that are vile, lingering shots of dead naked women in CSI or whatever.

No one on the thread has said "this sounds like a great game" or anything remotely like that. To jump to MNHQ thinking rApe as a game is ok is utter nonsense.

LassUnparalleled · 09/08/2015 11:20

I take it you missed the part where I said this scenario had actually been an essay subject and the tutors said it would not stand?

LassUnparalleled · 09/08/2015 11:18

Read your own post and see the blatant contradiction in what you said in the space of 2 sentences . At best the "coercion" might go towards sentencing.

"Settle a debate" really? It's a given there's nothing wrong with the game scenario?

differentnameforthis · 09/08/2015 11:12

MN leaving it to stand doesn't mean they think "rape as a game is OK" it means

1] they haven't had time to review it yet
2] it doesn't break their community standards
3] the thread isn't vile. The opinion of those who think rape is OK is vile. But op is asking us to settle a debate. That is perfectly valid

Oh & sorry but you said "I only did criminal law at first year of university and have never practised it." So really, you have no idea how it would go in court in terms of him being able to use it as a defence.

Although I agree, rape is vile.

differentnameforthis · 09/08/2015 11:08

LassUnparalleled Calm down...I hadn't read your post when I posted

LassUnparalleled · 09/08/2015 11:05

I've already said twice "how it would hold up in court" . Although the answer to your question is staring you in the face in your first sentence.

This thread is vile. I reported it last night and am disappointed to see MN think rape as a game is OK.

differentnameforthis · 09/08/2015 10:56

If B wasn't consenting to the act, of course it would still be rape.

How it holds up in court, as A was coerced, I'm not sure.

Lurkedforever1 · 09/08/2015 10:26

From your last post I'd guess your dp views rape as a physical act with mental repercussions, rather than the other way round.
As a female I can understand his perspective if we were talking about being punched etc, but not rape.
For pure violence I can imagine 'helping through' A in terms of A could be expected to hold his punches if we were talking about being beaten up, because it's all physical. Rape is entirely different.