Feminist Pub XX - may the summer rains wash the patriarchy down the plughole

Our works do was a dinner and dancing type thing. There was free wine but it honestly wasn't that rowdy. Certainly nobody went out with the intention of getting drunk.

I used to work for a bank and my division was in either the mirror or the sun in 2008/2009 because of our distasteful, lavish christmas party. We did all get made redundant a few years later though!

I'm watching University Challenge and I was already annoyed about the privilege afforded to people who go to Oxbridge but then got really annoyed when they got all the questions about Emmeline Pankhurst/feminism wrong. Only Connect will cheer me up, I love Victoria Coren-Mitchell.

My department just does a meal for Christmas. We love it, one table, very little drinking because most of us are driving. I don't understand the culture of going out to get drunk, even though I did do that occasionally as a student.

What kickass says is very true. And I live in the Bible Belt where the culture is even more abstemious than the rest of the country.

One thing that my workplace does that I really like is that we have parties to celebrate people's milestone anniversaries with the organization. No booze though, just food and lots of it. For five years, it's afternoon tea (US Southern version so usually iced tea), for 10 it's a lunch party and for 20 and beyond it's whatever you want. The big ones have themes chosen by the honoree.

I live in the US and people would be hugely shocked that anyone beyond the student years went out to get drunk. Of course people drink and get drunk, but I haven't encountered anyone, even people in their 20s, thinking about going for a night out specifically to get wasted. It just doesn't seem to be part of the culture. Even when going to a bar to watch a football game, which lasts 4 hours, people will get a little 'buzzed' but that's pretty much the limit. I'm sure there are hard drinkers, but it's not such a mainstream thing to do. Being out and about in town on a Saturday night is a completely different atmosphere.

I get the impression from conferences etc (not worked outside UK) that British working culture has a greater tendency to be focused around alcohol for socialising than many other countries. Whilst I very much enjoyed a drink or 5 when younger, it can feel very limiting. Especially that idea of "keeping up" with colleagues alcohol consumption which is obviously tougher for most women.

I enjoyed my office party this year. My unit is small (12 people) and predominantly female (9 out of 12). We went out for dinner - we all fit round a single table. Everyone had transport provided by the company, but no one could drink to excess as it was a Monday night and we all had work in the morning. I used to hate the really big parties that I used to get invited to though.

Actually I still get invited, but fortunately company policy only allows me to attend one Christmas party per year, so I have a valid excuse for declining the invitation

Oh and the recession has played a big role in scaling back or stopping holiday parties for businesses. It's really not seemly to have a party when huge layoffs are on the horizon. With the US economy now bouncing back, it will be interesting to see if there is an upswing in partying.

I read an article the other day that I can't now find that said among other things, that liability issues (drinking,etc.) had something to do with it; these vary a lot by state. But also that parties were not well attended in some cases. That was what happened at my work. I think with family demands, more and more people were choosing not to come.

seneca, why do you think US workplaces are moving away from christmas parties?

I hate it when things get even mildly contentious in the pub. Peace and love, y'all.

By apologising? I hardly think so.

Although I missed you calling her out for doing the exact same on several other threads with no apology... or is it just me that's not nice?

Anyway, the pub is generally accepted by everyone not to be the place to fall out. So I'll leave you to cheerlead for Lass and move on.

Are you invalidating lass's lived experience Plays well? That isn't nice.

My workplace no longer has a holiday party. It seems to be a trend here in the US. In fact, there seem to be fewer Christmas parties of any kind these days at least among my circle of friends, which suits me fine. We do have plans to attend a Hogmanay party that a Scottish friend is giving; my brother has been asked to be first foot, being tall and dark haired: well some of it is still dark, anyway. That party should be fun, if we can manage to keep DH awake until the bells.

I think most of the pressure of Christmas stems from capitalism/consumer culture. Buy lots of food, which you then have to prepare. Buy lots of presents, which you have to wrap and deliver. Buy cards which have to write and post. When you have children you have the added thing of making Christmas 'special' which seems to involve expensive experiences to visit Santa or tripa to the theatre/panto.

I'm only giving a card to my mum this year, not buying for many people. DH is sorting out his family. DS has seen Santa 3 times for free, which is good as he cried twice. I am taking on responsibility for shopping and cooking which is something DH normally does.

I wish I'd thought to start asking male colleagues if they were 'all ready for xmas'. Women have been asking me that and thinking I'm super organised when I said yes.

My office party was amazing. Lots of free wine and hardly any sexism

This made me laugh like a drain.

And you're right PAQ, Lass always listing her personal experience as gospel is no reason for anyone to be rude and snarky.

I apologise unreservedly.

Playwswell, lass was only listing her experience, no need to get all rude and snarky.

no I realise that not everyone is stressed out, only women seem to be

Not remotely my experience in a work context.Things which have been happily trundling on going nowhere assume a huge importance as 24/12 arrives. One of my male partners is heading for a breakdown.

It was the wedding anniversary of DH's mum and step-dad, so not even his parents. We'd never sent a card before.

Every year she makes a really obvious 'thing' about getting us a card for our anniversary. I am convinced this is her PA way of making a point to me. She frequently behaves like this.

Anyway, we're 4,000 miles away. DH safely home from Texas and hopefully not going again next week. The tree is lit and the cat is snoring. That's pretty much everything I want for Christmas.

Damn, kickass the things you learn on MN. You were expected to send anniversary cards to your in-laws?

I'm not a big Christmas person at all. And now DH is retired and I am still working and in a job where the end of the calendar year is hectic so if anything Christmassy gets done in our house, he does it. In fact, I just got home from work after a very tiring week; he's out to a Christmas party and I am into the wine, a big ole box of shortbread, MN, and some mindless TV. Noel, Noel

never - it was a gentle 'playful' slap on the back of my hand! As I walked into the room she took my hand and gave it a little gentle slap, while telling me that I forgot her anniversary (which I didn't even know about). I told her it was DH's job to do cards for his family and she dropped the subject.

If she knew that we don't do cards except for closest family, she would probably faint. She counts how many cards she gets each year. I totally get why DH hates all that stuff.

I only do cards for relatives I don't see at Christmas, so I'm now down to one aunt to send a card to. Dh sends cards to any of his relatives that we don't see, he's got LOADS to send.

I don't care about his random family members addressing us as Mr and Mrs Dpname, they did that before we were married, but I have firmly corrected MY family who tried it.

kickass She slapped you?? Do her for assault.

I don't send any cards - DH does all the cards for his family and the neighbours.

Some of his relatives (whom I don't know) send cards to Mr and Mrs DHfirstname DHsecondname. But I do not intend to acknowledge their existence.

I come from a family where it is expected that the women do everything (very few women in my entire family work ft, but me working ft doesn't seem to get me off the hook) and have ILs who 100% think it's my job to do all cards etc. (MIL once slapped me because I forgot her anniversary.)

When I started moaning about it to DH, he said he hates the ridiculous cards/presents stuff so didn't want to do it. As a test of his veracity, I just stopped doing it, to see if he'd get cross with me (LTB), not do it (He's lazy but honest) or start doing it (had been leeching off me). Turns out he's lazy but honest. I decided it was the way to go, so now we do NO gifts to extended family and a max. of 10 cards.

Which leaves us with time and money to spend on ourselves! Result!

I really do think the number of people who buy gifts for cousins etc, and send about 100 cards is quite gross, actually. I'm much happier with a scaled down, less stressful time.

I've done nothing about Christmas and won't be doing anything . I hate it, have done since I was a teenager. It's not compulsory.