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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Mother jailed for failing to protect daughters from sexual abuse by their father

109 replies

DonkeySkin · 17/01/2015 13:01

In line with the thread on women being jailed in El Salvador for miscarrying, this happened in Oz recently:

www.abc.net.au/news/2015-01-17/mother-sentenced-over-abuse-of-daughters-by-their-father/6022518

Sometimes I think the world is becoming more woman-hating by the day Sad

OP posts:
Threeplus1 · 17/01/2015 15:06

The only person these children had to protect them was their mother (especially given how rural and isolated they were). She failed to do so. Yes, she was also a victim, but she could have and should have reported. Is the outcome of not doing so any worse than if she actually had? Those children have now lost her too and will be left to fend for themselves.

MaryWestmacott · 17/01/2015 15:05

I agree with Thumbwitch too - it must have been a hard situation for her, but she seems to have made no effort to protect her children.

Everyone who neglects or abuses their children have a reason they do it. There are no reasons that make it ok.

BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 17/01/2015 15:04

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AskBasil · 17/01/2015 15:04

I do agree that people who fail to protect children from abuse - even vulnerable people - have to be held accountable for that. I'm just not sure if prison is the right way to do that and if that's the means we're going to use, then we really need to put in place proper support for vulnerable people who do report. We've got sod-all at the moment.

TooMuchCantBreathe · 17/01/2015 15:03

Buffy, you don't know the qualification of the people commenting.

As has been said above though, had it been coerced sex act the plea would be not guilty. She wasn't jailed for his crimes, she was jailed for hers. One could argue hers wouldn't exist without his but then one could also argue the crime of speeding wouldn't exist without Ford motor Co.

Sometimes people make bad choices in terrible situations which is sad - but that doesn't change the decision they made.

MarjorieMelon · 17/01/2015 15:03

I agree Buffy.

BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 17/01/2015 15:02

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wickedlazy · 17/01/2015 15:00

And need needabumchange

FreudiansSlipper · 17/01/2015 15:00

what an awful situation

years of abuse and living in fear people do not act in the way that is expected they often become totally dominated by the abuser and unable to think for themselves

she may have believed that if she left, reported him he would kill them all and why would she think that was an empty threat she is aware of what a cruel sadistic violent man he is

yes of course we all have a responsibility to protect our children this is an extreme case she has pleaded guilty I am guessing as she feels tremendous guilt

i am not sure sending her to prison what it achieves

BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 17/01/2015 14:59

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wickedlazy · 17/01/2015 14:56

thumbwitch I completely agree with you there.

MarjorieMelon · 17/01/2015 14:56

I think it's very unlikely that her husband would be allowed any contact at all with any of the children if he is convicted of sexual abuse. Why would the mother have feared that he would be awarded sole contact.

cailindana · 17/01/2015 14:55

My own mother turned a blind eye to abuse and told me to shut up about it as an adult. She was abused herself as a child (not to the same extent) and had myriad 'reasons' for her failure as parent. I don't forgive her. Her duty as a parent was to protect me. She failed. While I wouldn't like to see her jailed for it, I would not absolve her of any responsibility.

Neglect is neglect, no matter what the cause. Parents have to be held accountable for their duty towards their children.

BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 17/01/2015 14:53

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BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 17/01/2015 14:51

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Thumbwitch · 17/01/2015 14:50

In this particular case, it seems fairly clear cut that the woman was complicit and involved in the abuse - naked daughter sleeping in the marital bed? As well as the sexual act etc.

She was obviously in an abuse situation herself as well, but she still failed to protect her daughters from the same abuse. And for that, I think she does deserve punishment. Not because she's female, but because she failed in her duty of care to her DDs. IF it were the other way around, and she had been beating her DDs and the father had failed to protect them, I think HE should have been punished as well.

I missed whether or not the father was jailed and for how long, is that mentioned? Obviously he should be in jail for much longer!

DonkeySkin · 17/01/2015 14:46

EElisaveta, yes, she has been jailed for failing to stop her husband abusing their daughters. Not for any criminal act that she committed (except, perhaps, 'performing an indecent act in front of her daughter', which could apply to any woman who was sexually assaulted in front of her children).

I am certainly not 'excusing her behaviour entirely'. I'm saying that women should not be held responsible for their male partner's violence. A court holding a woman criminally responsible for failing to stop her partner's violence towards their children sets a very dangerous precedent, one that has sinister implications for all women with children trapped in abusive relationships, and which fails utterly to comprehend the dynamics of those relationships (in which it is well documented that many terrorised women develop Stockholm Syndrome).

I am not claiming she has been a good mother to her children. Maybe she is neglectful, maybe she is selfish, almost certainly she is trauma-bonded to her partner. It still doesn't mean she should be jailed for his crimes.

OP posts:
AskBasil · 17/01/2015 14:46

I think there's 2 issues here:

  1. The responsibility everyone has to protect children and not enable, facilitate or allow their abuse.
  1. The fact that when women try and protect their children from abuse, they are punished.

This woman feared she would lose her home and children if she reported and actually, she was right to fear that - the result of splitting from a man often is poverty for women and children. She may also have feared that he would kill her and some of the children if he reported and she was right to fear that - abusive men often kill women and children when the woman decides to end the relationship. And then often, the man involved gets sole contact with the children once he's released from prison after a period of time (a year, 18 months) and so the woman is even less able to protect the younger ones, than when he lives with her and she doesn't report.

The motivation to not report, is at least as strong as that to report and it sounds to me like this woman fell between the gap between those 2 things. The solution is to ensure that the motivation to report is stronger by protecting women, automatically banning fathers who are abusive from sole contact, locking them up for longer and keeping proper tabs on them when they're released from prison so that women feel safe. Then we can prosecute women who fail to protect, in the full knowledge that there was absolutely no excuse not to. At the moment that's not the case. Women are punished if they do report and punished if they don't. And meanwhile, men are let off the hook. I wonder what her husband's sentence was and whether he'll get sole contact when he gets released from prison.

differentnameforthis · 17/01/2015 14:45

She pleaded guilty to three charges of performing an indecent act with her husband while her eldest daughter, aged about 16 or 17, was present

If she had been sexually assaulted in front of her daughter, she would have explained it was sexual assault in the presence of a minor, and not pleaded guilty? YY! That is what I was focusing on too. She was away from her abuser & had an opportunity to give her side, she had a chance to say whether it was an assault or her performing a sexual act on him. She pleased guilty to the latter, so I can understand why she was convicted.

She pleaded guilty, which is why she was convicted.

Shakey1500 · 17/01/2015 14:44

Everyone blaming women for everything?

Anyhow, I also don't see it as woman/women hating. There were choices available and she made the lowest of the low choice.

NeedABumChange · 17/01/2015 14:42

I completely understand women who fail to escape abuse for themselves but couldn't feel more opposite towards those who stay and allow their children to be abused. Pretending to be the good parent when they are just as bad.

wickedlazy · 17/01/2015 14:42

She had no driving licence. Presumably no financial independence. She feared losing her home and family

Oh then that's different. She let her husband sexually abuse her daughters because she wanted a roof over her head, to not be attacked herself by him and financial security. She didn't want to loose the life she had, sure what's a little bit of kiddie fiddling in the grand scheme of things Hmm

The moment he tried to initiate a sexual act in front of her oldest, she should have rung the police. Or at least at the first opportunity. She didn't, she let it happen again. And again. And that's why she is going to jail, and why she deserves to be there.

TooMuchCantBreathe · 17/01/2015 14:41

Ooh you are getting very upset and wordy about a case you simply do not have that kind of information about. This is the first case to come to court. He will be in court soon for the abuse of the dc. For all you know there is another case upcoming for his abuse of the wife or maybe not. Perhaps she participated knowingly and willingly and used his character to explain her actions - it wouldn't be the first time. Perhaps not but the fact is that you don't know.

To the poster going on about the article being about her not him - that is because it is about her trial. Obviously it's going to focus on her. The telling thing would be them focusing on her when reporting his trial.

hmc · 17/01/2015 14:39

I don't see it as woman hating at all - not one little bit. The mother failed to act.

wickedlazy · 17/01/2015 14:35

She pleaded guilty to three charges of performing an indecent act with her husband while her eldest daughter, aged about 16 or 17, was present

That is vile! If she had been sexually assaulted in front of her daughter, she would have explained it was sexual assault in the presence of a minor, and not pleaded guilty?

And the daughter was sleeping naked in her parents bed?

This woman failed to protect her daughters and deserves jail. She was complicit in the abuse. I hope the three daughters can move on from all this and find some happiness.