Feminist Pub 16: where the Bluestockings develop armoured stockings to deal with the thousand paper cuts

I agree that "man style" and "woman style" don't map onto men and women necessarily. In this case, though, three men were chosen and I (and presumably lots of other women) weren't.

Actually, I am going to rewrite it shortly as I'm trying for another grant. I am polishing up my "man speak" right now.

poofus, I find that shocking but not surprising.

I recently heard about a similar comment in the context of marking university scripts.

Incidentally, when I heard that, someone told me there was some evidence to show that readers think they can distinguish a male 'style' from a female one, but they aren't accurate. So, while I agree with yonic that there is a style we are conditioned to interpret as feminine, I am less sure that it's always women who use it.

shitting hell poofus. who comprised your institution's review panel?

Crikey!

I do read important emails and take out all the "modest" statements before sending. Yes, I know this is colluding with the patriarchy, but shit needs to get done and all...

Yes, I think they meant that some of it was a bit tentative. OK, I can deal with that (although that's annoying in itself because at this stage of a research project of course it's tentative!). What I wasn't keen on was "write it like a man" because we are putting the men's applications forward and not yours.

Yes, an academic grant - but it wasn't the funders, it was my own institution's internal review process. Only three applications could be put forward. My unmanly application was the fourth.

BDad, I beg to differ...

Caveat: NAMALT, NAWALT.

Women tend to write "I think, it seems to me, in my opinion" type statement more often whereas men tend to write "It is, it will, the situation is" statements more often.

Does that sound familiar?

what do they even mean by that, the old 'devoid of emotion' chestnut?

Poofus - no that's terrible, there is no man style!

I usually lurk but could do with some views on this, please, if anyone has any. I've just had a grant application turned down. I had some in-person feedback, which should have been very helpful, but it wasn't. It mainly focused on how good my application actually was, and how they'd wanted it to get funding, except for the fact that I "need to write it more like a man". Is this really OK? I would perhaps have taken it better if it weren't the case that the three people who did get funding are all men.

yonic Are you me? I lectured the DC all the way to school this morning. Everyone stared at me. But I did refrain from telling them all to fuck off.

I've had the what-did-your-last-slave-died-off morning.

And the bloody internet is still not working. Thank goodness for smart phones.

I went for the cafe this morning though I have loads of work to do because I had a major "god, I'm crap at this mothering business" moment this morning!

Have just about recovered so should probably head back to my laptop!

Ah that's shit puffins - hope you hear good things from the lawyer but a battle is always exhausting.

Symph. Is horrendous, I hope they are successful in their campaign to get to the echr and sue the bastards.

I usually lurk, but the buggy dilemma called to me with my 3 under 5 an inline double like a Phil and Ted's could be a good choice it depends how much you need the basket space. Umbrella fold doubles are all useless for lots of use, they're just not sturdy or well designed enough. I have a slim side by side double, mountain buggy duet which I love and goes in and out of single doors no problem - the tiny aisles can still be a problem in crowded shops. The other options I find work quite well is single and toddler in a soft structured sling on my back.

You're right that life is designed for unencumbered people though.

Oh, brilliant!

I am so pleased - yay!

(And yes, I'm me. )

LRD! You're you again!

Everything seems to be on the move, job-wise. Two recruiters called me today and both have positions they want to put me forward for, so fingers crossed that it's all finally happening.

I hope it was helpful Puffins. As I said, I'm a bit out of date. But sacking someone for being off sick, especially where it is a work injury, would be the sort of thing that would generally have us gathered around in the office debating how legally risky it was to the client. It really isn't a simple thing to do.

Also, when you mention it being out of whack for 'weeks', does that mean the accident was quite recent? You'd normally expect months of absence with no reasonable prospect of return for your 'average' capability dismissal. Where it might get more tricky is if you've not been there long enough to have straight unfair dismissal rights but don't fall under disability. But that's something you need to work through with a proper lawyer.

They sound, TBH, like they are arseholes who've seen a chance to reduce their 'cost base'. Charming people.

Thanks, and thanks especially to Penguins. I'm going to talk to an actual real lawyer (as opposed to one of the claims management companies) as soon as I can get an appointment, and I'll bring up your points, that was extremely helpful. The company I work for has a proud history of 10 hour contracts, and my direct management are making noises about managing people out of the business, because we're over our contract base and head office are getting jumpy.

Buffy you had such crap birth experiences that SI joint problems is just a kick in the teeth. I am hoping to get an MRI done soon, to see how badly it's been damaged, but my sacrum is visibly out of whack and has been for weeks now, physio notwithstanding. So, hoping for the best, but planning for the worst iyswim?

I was just so shocked that, despite me doing everything right and the lack of communication from my work, they felt it to be a good idea to get someone from outside the organisation to break it to me that I'm on borrowed time. (Especially as my line manager has been off for far longer than I have, for a sports related injury and no one is talking about demoting or sacking her!)

Oh, and re. feminist issues, children and space - I've just read Jane Hawking's autobiography, and that is really scary reading. She writes about how she had times when she was, essentially, choosing between going to her husband (who couldn't move without her, and was quite fragile) and going after her child, or going to A&E with her child or her husband. It's absolutely terrifying.

Hi all. Sorry, I missed the bus and had to catch up. I NC for trivial reasons (I'm less searchable under this name, and want to be incognita except to you lovely people for a bit).

annie, good on you for getting two jobs - I just gasped at the first post, but how shit it's in the wrong place. Though, having commuted from one to the other, I do take your point, and IME you're lucky if it's 2.5 hours each way, so it is quite a brutal commute.

Clearly people do want you (as of course they bloody should!), so I hope the right thing will come along soon.

I'd seen articles about the operation before. It's awful, isn't it? I can't begin to think.

It is on a much, much lower level ... but it has always shocked me how some medics see things like women being incontinent as a result of labour. As if it's some minor issue, and not worth bothering about.

puffins - what the fuck? This sounds awful.

Was this the ACAS helpline Puffins? It's a great resource and everything, but please don't rely on them for anything as complicated as this. There are a lot of complicated, interwoven issues here and it doesn't sound to me (ex employment lawyer) that they've fully appreciated them all.

There may be issues of disability law and reasonable adjustments. If you are disabled (and you might be within the meaning of the law, you'd have to find out) they have to make adjustments to try and allow you to stay in your job. If that isn't possible, before they dismissed you they'd be expected to think more broadly about adjustments (for example, not saying that you want this to happen, but you've talked about not creating a junior job. It's true that they don't have to create a 'fake' job. But surely if they promoted someone into your management role it would leave their old job as a vacancy?)

Even leaving that aside, whether they can dismiss you for competence is quite complex and depends on things like how long you've been off and prognosis. Even very senior employment lawyers and HR Directors will be cautious about saying it's ok to dismiss someone after a workplace injury (which doesn't affect the law, but does affect the sympathy of the tribunal, which is a big issue in employment law). I wouldn't rely on a helpline (or occ health) to make that call.

There may be additional complications if you have PHI insurance through your work. If not, look into whether you have it through any other avenue (most commonly mortgage).

Finally, in terms of initial comments, yes, personal injury is a possibility. It sounds like they royally fucked up health and safety.

I've been out of the area a few years now, but I don't think it's as simple as putting up with it.

I hope you aren't in tooo much pain and that it is being sympathetically managed with enough medication. So sorry to hear what happened to you.