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Original poster

Any good examples to help point out sexism to my DH?

135 replies

BertieBotts · 25/11/2014 20:26

As he announced this evening that I am "just looking for sexism everywhere" (Nope, not looking, it just is there) and he was upset that I saw the world as such a black dark evil place Hmm (I don't).

I'm not particularly interested in explanations of privilege like the video game difficulty setting thing, just examples that he will "get". I used the example that a man might be upset if a man he knows wants to date his sister whereas a woman would never be upset at a woman wanting to date her brother, unless she thought the woman was a total psychopath. Well, that didn't work because he has 3 sisters, all an entire generation older than him so of course they have been overprotective and ridiculous over every GF he has ever had Grin So I called "Friends" and he started making up arguments.

He gets the "big stuff", but he doesn't see the smaller, everyday type of feminism, and that's what I'd like to open his eyes to if possible. I know that a lot of it is just that it's invisible to him because it happens so often to women that we don't mention it and men, especially if they don't do it, don't realise that it's happening at all.

OP posts:
AmberTheCat · 02/12/2014 14:42

There was a brilliant thread on here a while ago about what it would be like if gender roles were reversed. Lots of eye opening stuff in that.

Ask him to look at any newspaper, or listen to or watch any news bulletin, and mentally substitute any men mentioned for women, and vice versa. The world looks very different (I can't stop myself doing this now!).

SunnyBaudelaire · 02/12/2014 09:58

tell him about my sexually attractive single mother friend who was practically hounded out of a charming Sussex village. for real.

purplefeathers · 02/12/2014 09:54

That video is brilliant. I mean, its awful, but if anyone's ever in doubt of the different ways in which men and women are portrayed in popular media, this illustrates it brilliantly.

I've been known to as football fans the 'who is the most capped England player?'. Of course they all proudly announce 'Peter Shilton' when actually the answer is Rachel Yankey who has 125 to Shilton's 123 (I think). The response I get to that is often depressing though-from eye rolls to 'I thought you meant real football' type comments.

Even if you Google 'most capped England player' it's Shilton's name that comes up. Yankey doesn't feature in the top searches unless you specify 'women's football' or put 'Yankey' in the search.

That's depressing. What a fabulous achievement for Yankey, yet she's eclipsed by a man who has fewer caps.

Original poster
BertieBotts · 02/12/2014 08:58

I didn't know that about Maxine Carr. I liked that video, though, I've shared it on facebook.

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NuggetofPurestGreen · 02/12/2014 08:57

In a hurry so haven't RTFT (but will later!) so sorry if has been mentioned, but the whole 'slut' rhetoric. Eg a story I heard about some sport players having a threesome with a girl they met out in town. she was the 'dirty bitch' of course. Later I heard same girl described as the 'office bike'.

Original poster
BertieBotts · 02/12/2014 08:51

Oh yes, 18yo girls are expected to successfully navigate relationships with older men and be responsible for being coerced or abused, yet 18 year old boys aren't supposed to be able to read a 16yo girl's signals or interpret them correctly and hence are off the hook Confused

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sashh · 02/12/2014 08:23

Tofffee don't be depressed, be angry.

ToffeePenny · 01/12/2014 18:50

Not a single woman doing sport in 6 months sashh?!?

Now I'm depressed.

sashh · 01/12/2014 18:03

Just come across this - interesting www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=lNlKjUfmaUA

Every picture of a person published int he Sun over 6 months and pinned up, men on one side women on the other.

JeffreyGartnerEatsWell · 27/11/2014 20:48

ps, I agree wrt Maxine Carr, I think she has been demonised. She lied to cover her bf's ass but when she was made to understand that he HAD done it, not that he just needed an alibi, she confessed that her alibi was made up.

I was so shocked reading the comments about kendra on the daily mail website just now. she was 18, alone, broke, uneducated and people have said she should have been grateful to hh. it'd make you SICK reading it.

Women are constantly judged more harshly than men are judged. More is expected from an 18 year old girl than is expected from an 18 yo boy imo

purplefeathers · 27/11/2014 20:47

And let us not forget that it's become increasingly common for women to experience threats of sexual violence if they dare to speak out about anything. Men don't get the same reaction.

JeffreyGartnerEatsWell · 27/11/2014 20:45

yeh, programmes aimed at women are almost niche market. programmes aimed at mainly men are default.

purplefeathers · 27/11/2014 20:40

Young girls are constantly appraised on their looks or on what they're wearing. Both by adults known to them and 'kindly' strangers.

YonicScrewdriver · 27/11/2014 18:52

Is it possible for men to buy "girlfriend cut" jeans, I wonder?

sashh · 27/11/2014 06:33

Have another look at a newspaper and see how men and women are reported on in violent crime. Men have been reported as 'driven' to kill a woman due to jealousy and women, well a man can beat her up every day for years and it is reported as murder.

Women who are criminals are also vilified more than men.

Myra Hindley has been portrayed as worse than Ian Brady.
Maxine Carr - is she really so evil? Yes she lied about her boyfriend's whereabouts but she didn't actually kill anyone. No one knows if she knew about the murder, at the time she was hundreds of miles away so possibly not.
Fred and Rose West.

The Reva Steenkamp (?sp) murder, how many people knew her name for days later as it was all reported in terms of Pistorius.

Zazzles007 · 26/11/2014 19:58

he saw an article on 9gag about "things my rapist said to me" and decided to read them out to me

Not good Bertie Sad. On the other hand, I think that awareness of the depth that sexism is entrenched within society is going to be an ongoing learning process for your H, just as it is for all of us.

Original poster
BertieBotts · 26/11/2014 13:59

Yep I think just support really. TBH the whole thing started because I saw something in a cartoon series that he had introduced to DS and I hadn't seen and had assumed because DH thought it was OK that it would be suitable for a six year old, in my opinion it wasn't. So sort of lack of awareness.

There was also a thing where he saw an article on 9gag about "things my rapist said to me" and decided to read them out to me because he thought it was funny/shocking/unbelievable and didn't stop to think for one second that it might be a touch more upsetting for me than for him. Some of them were stuff that you might say in the context of a loving/consensual sexual relationship or encounter, which he found the most surprising and I found the most upsetting. That is the kind of thing that astounds me, most of the time he is fine and supportive of stuff but then he shows that he so spectacularly doesn't get it that it's like the bottom drops out of the world.

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OneDayWhenIGrowUp · 26/11/2014 13:39

Cailindana makes a good point. I would not presume that I knew about a black person's experience of racism in a particular circumstance, as I am not black. I would have to believe what they told me about their experience. Surely an intelligent male would come to a similar conculsion about a woman's experiences.

I think 'little' things can easily be invisible if you're not the victim of the intended discrimination, especially when that discrimination is so culturally embedded.

Playing devil's avocado for a minute, you say he notices individual instances of sexism/arsehole-ness, what is it that you would like to follow on from him joining up the dots? Challenging these things when he sees them, or just being able to listen to you rant and agree/support you in your frustration?

cailindana · 26/11/2014 12:59

The fact he feels he can claim to know better than you about how women are treated is sexism in action. Do you devalue his viewpoints on things he clearly knows more about? How can he claim to understand what being a woman is like?

YonicScrewdriver · 26/11/2014 12:16

Not just the daily mail, Bertie...

Analysis of why women make the front page (NB being royal or being a victim of crime is a common theme)

womeninjournalism.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Seen_but_not_heard.pdf

Comito · 26/11/2014 11:18

Ask if he ever thinks about women drivers in a derogatory way, i.e. 'typical woman driver!'

Original poster
BertieBotts · 26/11/2014 11:16

This thread has helped, actually, by reminding me how much he does get. I don't do birthdays for his family, he tends to take time off work if DC is ill (it's paid here anyway though which is nice :))

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Original poster
BertieBotts · 26/11/2014 11:12

Oh no, he's English :) He is amazed by the kindergarten's attitude towards him - it's annoying, actually, they will actively avoid giving him any useful information which means if he does pick ups for a few days I don't get to hear about things. He's not the only dad who picks up/drops off either!

I think my issue is that the things which are clear he notices, and the things which are more muddy but totally obvious to me, aren't to him. Because, oh, well the Daily Mail is a terrible paper, or that bloke is just an arsehole, or those men who don't do housework are bad husbands. He's seeing individual incidents of dealing with sexist/arsehole people, not the whole pattern which shows how endemic sexism is.

Maybe I'm asking too much? Confused

OP posts:
RiverTam · 26/11/2014 11:09

who in your family is the default carer if one of the DC is sick and needs to be off school - is it your or his employer who's expected to suck it up?

girl who takes charge - bossy
boy ditto - leader

LurcioAgain · 26/11/2014 11:05

Jeffrey! Shock

I hope you then changed solicitors.

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