Should the UK law on rape be changed?

Men can be raped by other men. But I doubt most men would consider that to be exactly the same offence as a woman having sex with them against their will or without consent (though I may be wrong).

Also, let's remember the word "rape" is not meant to be a judgement on how bad a particular sexual offence was, it rather describes a particular type of act. A crime classed as a serious sexual assault could potentially be just as "bad" (whether you mean violent/harmful/degrading or whatever) as rape, but just not involve that particular act. So I don't see that men (or, for that matter, women who are sexually assaulted but not raped) are necessarily losing out through the difference in terminology.

There is one other difference too (though men being raped is an anomaly here). Male-on-female rape carries the risk of pregnancy, which other sexual assaults are at least less likely to. This is relevant for several reasons. Firstly it is sometimes part of the reason rape happens - e.g. when used as a weapon of war by impregnating "the enemy's women", but for that matter also in abusive relationships to keep the woman tied to the abuser. Secondly, a pregnancy (particularly an unwanted pregnancy) may well have massive and permanent physical, mental, emotional, financial and social effects for the woman, on top of the effects of the rape itself (don't forget, pregnancy and childbirth can still kill you, even in the developed world but far more elsewhere). So I would see this as another reason to distinguish rape from other forms of sexual assault.

Rape is NOT an equal opportunities crime OP

If you care so much about this issue why not go on a men's forum and campaign on there. Most men are actually raped by other men not women anyway.

Yes it would harm women. It would not recognise the gendered nature of the crime for a start. It would minimise the millenia of years that rape has been used as a tool to keep women frightened and hurt them and the fact that is continues still today.

May be when we have true sexual equality we can start changing terms to reflect that equality. But whilst the oppression is there, it needs to be named.

And no men are not frequently raped by women. As said before 99% of sexual violence is perpetrated by men.

Yeah, fair point, Puffins.

It does hold. The law's full of highly specific terms that apply only to a certain type of crime committed in a certain manner. Rape is one of those. The complaint, as put by these hypothetical chaps of yours, is that there's a word for a crime which can only be committed with a penis. That's all it boils down to. Daft, when you think about it, eh?!

I mean, if they really want to be raped they could place themselves in suitably vulnerable circumstances until a nasty enough penis-owner comes along ...

Just report the thread.

"But I do think that nobody takes seriously the effect that men may feel having woke to found a woman having sex with them, in the same way they would if the roles were reversed"

Really? Have you seen the "sleep sex" debates on here? Plenty of people don't think a man having sex with a sleeping woman, especially if he went to bed with her the night before, is a crime of sexual violence.

I can't fucking believe this OP. There are aprox 85,000 women a year who are victims of rape, only 5-10% of them report it. Of those who report it, only 6% get a conviction. AND SOMEONE IS PROPOSING WE CHANGE THE LAW SO THAT WOMEN CAN BE ACCUSED OF RAPE???

Give me strength. I used to work for a charity that supported rape victims and I went to a lot of meetings and conferences about how to increase rape convictions. I attended one once where Betsy Stanko, an academic and advisor to the Met Police on violence against women, attended. She basically said the only way we could get realistic convictions for women who were victims of rape would be if they were tried by specially trained judges ( as opposed to juries )

That's what I think should happen, not this ignorant, bullshit proposal.

Sorry for rant. ( actually I'm not. I'm sick of this shit)

I am actually pro renaming rape to "grievous sexual bodily assault"

Me, too. For now, though, as has been exhaustively explained, rape is the legal term for a specific type of grievous sexual bodily assault that is perpetrated using a penis. If some person shoves a broken bottle up your fanjo, that is not rape.

It isn't complicated prashad. And your "but whyyyy shouldn't feminists campaign on behalf of men?" arguments are a bit wet.

Equality means having equal rights, opportunities, rewards, etc. Currently one half of the population has markedly fewer of those, taking an overall view. So campaigning for the right to use a special legal term, on behalf of the privileged sector, doesn't seem like a major priority.

You also seem to be avoiding the fact that men can be, and frequently are, raped.

"Like if we said white people can be mugged, but black people are 'relieved of their money' (Bad example I know)." No because it is a false equivalence. You are reversing the power dynamic there. White people oppress black people. Men oppress women, yet you are arguing for men (the greater power) on this thread and then reversing it to argue for the oppressed in your example.

Do you think that women have been liberated from male oppression?

No I'm saying that once women are liberated sexual equality will come. You can't have sexual equality until women are liberated.

But it is the MPs who bring in legislation . So the fact that they are disproportionally male is more likely to have a disproportional effect. Similarly, the justice system is run by men, for men (Helena Kennedy is very good on this if you are interested. I suspect not though).

But again it goes back to the thousands of years of history of male violence against women as a means of oppression. The opposite cannot be said. The UK recognises that rape is a specific crime perpetrated by men for that reason (even if its against other men).

Rape is about penetration too. I think you'll find that even in those countries where women can be convicted of rape. That rape is done by penetration.

Feminists fight for the liberation of women. Once we've got that, sexual equality will be more achievable. Your posts seem to be coming from a position that equality has been achieved. If that is the case then you don't know what equality looks like. Because it certainly doesn't look like 85000 women a year, in the UK alone, being raped by men.

And at remaining neutral. Yeah right. Your first post on MN is in FWR, innocuously asking about all those nasty women raping men. Course it is. (Btw 99% of sexual violence is perpetrated by men. There is a pattern there.)

"Meanwhile, the men's rights movement is relatively tiny and useless." You said it. There may be a reason for this.