Discussion with female friend re Ched

Oh, sorry - I read that wrong.

Who said 'only'?

I don't understand why this thread descended into a slagging off of liberlas and accusation of the OP being anti-semitic (and a kitten kicker). I also don't understand how discussing the hypotheticals around how a jury reached a verdict in a rape trial could land anyone, even MN in hot water.

And the thread only proves why conviction rates are so low if you are referring to some of the totally illogical thought processes which go on with regard to culpability and capacity in rape.

This thread kinda proves why conviction rates are so low.

Sorry this reads wrong

"or who is raped because they feel too intimidated to express non-consent verbally."

She is not raped BECAUSE of her fear to say no, obviously. She is raped because she is with a rapist, and knows full well that a "No" is extremely likely to make no difference to her being raped and might well result in more violence being inflicted on her.

Sorry people I didn't proof read before posting.

I'm a bit confused.

I don;t think it's libellous at all to wonder whether teh courts / police / juries / society at large are more or less likely to be sympathetic to someone who is raped when drunk, or who is raped because they feel too intimidated to express non-consent verbally.

And even if Beyond does link it to the CE case, he has been found guilty of rape. To speculate over the reactions of people like jurors / if they were told that she went along with it because she was scared, rather than that she was too pissed to consent, is fine. He has been convicted of rape.

Oh, I see what you mean now, smashbox. You weren't very clear.

Picture yourself sober but perhaps having taken hay fever medicine or anything else that makes you woozy. You are in a hotel room, not one you booked, with a guy you've met. You are naked and in the middle of sex.

Another guy lets himself in without knocking or asking. He sees you are in the middle of sex but doesn't apologise and walk out. He comes on in and asks if he can have a go. he's clearly a friend of the first guy and it turns out the first guy, the one who asked you back, texted him to say he was with "a bird". So second guy has decided to come along, uninvited, knowing exactly what was going on but not knowing anything about you other than your sex.

Both guys are strong and have known each other since childhood; they've just met you.

Do you feel safe or threatened?

Assault can mean sexual assault, smashbox.

Btw, I don't think MN gets into any trouble if people state They might have voted differently if they were on the jury for the CM case.

The case i'm trying to reference? You think this is a rare occurrence? The only rare thing is that it got to court and someone got a guilty verdict.

Assault contrary to section I can't remember of the criminal justice act 1988

Battery is the actual beating, assault is to put in fear of "immediate infliction of unlawful force"

Beyond hasn't mentioned an assault other than the rape

Why are you so determined not to comment?

I had willing, amazing, fully consenual (albeit slightly tipsy) sex with a friend, then his mate turned up and i felt threatened by my vulnerable state. That non-libellous enough for you?

Where did i allege assault?

"raped by two men when I was drunk" - one of the men in the case you are clearly trying to not very subtly reference was acquitted.

I'm not going to comment.

So you're alleging assault then Beyond? Before even rape?

That Huffpo blogger lost me when she couldn't spell Michael Buerk's name right. If you're going to base an entire article around something someone said, do a quick google of them first, mmmm?

(Sorry, WAY off topic.)

Ok smashbox, lets say i was raped by two men while i was drunk, one a friend and the other not. Assuming i even got to court, do you think it would go differently in court and in the media to how this case has gone, if i said i felt threatened by the presence of two 'built' men and naked, alone me.

I haven't commented on the specifics of the Ched Evans case at all. Or at least, I don't think I have?

Please can you point me to where I have and I shall ask mumsnet to remove those posts.

Well smash

Earlier on you said " I didn't comment on the Ched Evans case" when it was what everyone else was talking about and you felt quite comfortable commenting.

So you can just do that again, really

I don't think MN will get in hot water if you give your opinion at all.

X posts all over the place!

Thats fine, im not on about him, they "had sex" before chedwyn the rapist even got there :)