Minor male entitlements

"I think I make a sort of lazy assumption when I post here in F/WR that I don't believe or condone discriminatory/sexist stuff, and others know this"

Posters come and go, and your first couple of posts on this thread were directly "at" Pepper who I think more mis-phrased her posts than meant what you thought she meant.

So I don't think you can assume everyone knows everyone's back story (I don't think I know Pepper, for example)

www.ted.com/speakers/amy_cuddy

Pan you are being disingenuous. Again. We see you.

^"I think I make a sort of lazy assumption when I post here in F/WR that I don't believe or condone discriminatory/sexist stuff, and others know this - maybe I should be clearer?" Here's an idea how about you just don't condone discriminatory/sexist stuff.

You first post:
"Thick Asian men, and women being ''most human". Maybe you aren't as "smart enough" as you think you self-declare, Pepper." You were arguing with the wrong person and personally attacking Pepper as well. For no reason.

And as for Buffy supposedly playing the victim. Pot. Kettle. Black. You came on this thread on the attack and been playing the "but but but you misunderstand me card". WE don't misunderstand you. We see you.

Amy cuddy ted talk on your body language - can someone else post the link. It highlighted male entitlement to me! But it also gives some pointers - about the impact of powerful posing.

A good friend of mine passed on a good talk about body language. What you are missing here is that is that with body language if there are two people and one acts dominant then the other will act submissive. Women can act submissive. There is a great ted talk about this and how you need to fake it until you make it.

oh folks have posted while I typed the Gettysburg Address!

So no-ones posted, in between, about male privilege!
Buffy - this is in a spirit of honesty and authentic 'feedback', okay? We have significant differences, and that's prob. down to sex, age, life experiences, attitudes, work experiences, beliefs, socialisation, class (possibly), ambitions etc.

But, for this purpose..

I'm not sure you read your own posts very well, tbh.

The 'picking apart of language' bit is remarkably odd. I see you do that with me, and others on other threads, who disagree with you. Yes we can all do it from time to time, but to suggest/imply I do that and you don't is a bit off. The evidence is there. I've never said 'everyone knows you're a nasty' for example, and the diction you choose, at least between us, draws you out as a 'victim' when that is far from the truth. And yes, you did make unpleasant points about me somewhere up ^ there based on not much. Your assumptive style was really quite irritating, and, to me, beneath you.
I think I make a sort of lazy assumption when I post here in F/WR that I don't believe or condone discriminatory/sexist stuff, and others know this - maybe I should be clearer? I do certainly know that in a society where life as a woman or child is fraught with problems of Equality in all it's forms, then it's incumbent on 'us' to make our actions and words clear. So, to my mind, 'fighting' with you is a bit of a waste of effort and time.
As well as snr manager in my org. I'm also a trade union rep (highly unusual) so exchanging unpleasantries with you is really small beer. I am assuming that you feel the same in whatever challenges you face in RL?

So, no to me at least there are bigger issues at hand than whether Buffy and Pan agree or insult on a message board.
What do you think?

Justwhateverreally, I feel the same. What started as an interesting thread has descended into a rearguard action against rampant whataboutery. It happens depressingly often and it's usually the same men who feel the need to do it.

Buffy,

As in 'not well brought up'. You really do have a low opinion of me to ask that question.

Noble,

Re coffee shops, there are plenty of older retired men and the odd SAHD who are being crowded out. And the staff, of course, of mixed sex. I am totally unconvinced about armrests. I did notice, the other day, a woman who parked her handbag and coat on the tube seat next to her on a crowded tube, with plenty of people standing. No one asked her to move them.

Will send you a PM re the teaching, as you were v supportive of me, earlier.

I'm really disappointed by this thread.
The first few posts really rang a bell with me, I started recalling examples of my own (swerving into my path when walking then positioning themselves right in front of me and slowing down, wtf?), and started reading with joy that I've found people who have the same experiences (leg spreading! Arm rests!)

Is this the FWR section or what? Because all I can see here is men butting in on a conversation and giving it the whole 'oh the menz' thing.

I CBA to do the polite arguing thing which some posters here are valiantly trying. I just feel sad that such a promising thread has been so derailed with the usual 'justify every little assertion' male sense of privilege.
I don't sometimes like the concept of privilege because I feel it can be used to undermine a class analysis very often, but here it is v relevant.

Men are brought up to think that their wants and needs are more important so yes it is about upbringing.
Yes there's dickheads in both men and women but even nice men still put themselves first. You just have observe people talking and living their lives to see that,

That's a bit depressing, giraffe. How do you compensate?

Buffy - cooking dinner. Will get back to you shortly.

Larry, on a thread where women are talking about men expecting to take the armrests, for women to give way to them, to dominate meetings, it is then hardly equivalent to talk about how women with young children dominate coffee shops when men are at work. Men aren't being pushed out of coffee shops by women here, they're not even in the picture!

Are you teaching now? I was thinking about my new classes. I've got a Y11 group that I had in Y10 that has 9 girls and 21 boys (top set). The girls are entirely crowded out, understandably you might think. But now I've got a Y9 set where the gender split is reversed. And guess what, even though the boys are in a small minority, they are still crowding the girls out, and dominating the class. As my school is boy heavy I've not really had a girl heavy group before so it has surprised me how obvious it is.

Wealthy with poor upbringing. It is a bad combo. You can be wealthy and behave decently.

Pomme

Not having to so thank you cards. They never do.

Oh, ok. I can get you a nice pen too?

Buffy.

I don't think sex is the predominant determinant of behaviour in this area, more upbringing and wealth.

Well, I'd agree with you on the upbringing - males are generally brought up to feel more 'entitled' than women are. Wealth, not so much! Go to an impoverished city centre on a weekend and have a look at the 'entitlements' by gender.