Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Why are feminists so threatened by the MRA movement?

635 replies

LaVoixDeLaRaison · 09/09/2014 18:47

When I was at university, the Gender Equality society (of which I was a member) chose to rename itself the Feminist society, arguing that the only way equality could be achieved was by focusing on women's issues. This led some other students to set up an MRA group, which was met with some resistance from the feminists. On this very board I see commenters angrily referring to MRAs as if they are all members of an evil homogeneous group.

Isn't it possible that men and women both suffer oppression from society in different ways? That the levels of this oppression are not necessarily equal, but are still important if we are to achieve equality? I often see feminists agreeing with certain 'male issues' (e.g. media stereotypes, elevated male suicide rate), but suggesting that feminism has other priorities, and if they want to do something about these issues then they should make their own groups. Why do they get criticized when they do exactly that? Better still, wouldn't feminism be better off if it didn't alienate so many men (and women, focused on a wider range of issues, and stopped pitting the sexes against one another?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
12
BuffyBotRebooted · 09/09/2014 22:20

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BuffyBotRebooted · 09/09/2014 22:20

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LineRunner · 09/09/2014 22:19

' We'??

SevenZarkSeven · 09/09/2014 22:17

Ifyourehoppy

I liked it Grin

WinifredTheLostDenver · 09/09/2014 22:17

Who is this "we" of which you speak?

BuffyBotRebooted · 09/09/2014 22:17

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LaVoixDeLaRaison · 09/09/2014 22:16

PortofinoRevisited

Why have you reported me? For having an opinion different to yours? You do realize that this is why we get called 'feminazis' right? I have been polite throughout this discussion, avoided making any personal attacks or insults, and tried to the best of my ability to ground all of my arguments in logic or evidence. The same has not been true of everyone who has replied to me, but I'd like to thank those who have at least been courteous, even if they strongly disagreed.

Do you really think it's correct to ban people like me from posting? If so then I wish you well, you can live in your bubble and never have to come into contact with anyone who holds different opinions to you. I daresay this attitude might not serve you so well in the real world though.

OP posts:
PenguinsIsSleepDeprived · 09/09/2014 22:16

Porto - Is there a 'fee wine for feminists' campaign. I'll join!

SevenZarkSeven · 09/09/2014 22:16

LaVoix your posts are nonsensical.

"I'm glad that you agree that men can be oppressed too, even if you show a disregard for the lived experiences of men who don't fit your definition of those who can be oppressed."

What do you think my "etc" was for? It was to communicate that my list was not exhaustive. I am also not sure where I am "disregarding lived experiences". Is this about the insurance premiums again?

I also wonder if you need a quick look at some reference materials so as to understand what "oppression" actually means. "A man somewhere feels hard done by" is not evidence of systemic oppression.

"Should feminists concern themselves with the men who you believe are oppressed?"

Don't you believe that the groups of men I did mention (Poor men, non-white men (in certain countries), gay men lots and lots often to the point of death etc and so on.) are oppressed? It sounds like you don't Confused Which might explain why you have yet again failed to demonstrate any concern for these groups.

PenguinsIsSleepDeprived · 09/09/2014 22:15

Behold. A MAN has arrived. To tell us why we are all emotional and irrational and Doing. Feminism. Wrong. He even has the voice of reason in his name. Wow. That's us told.

LaVoixDeLaRaison · 09/09/2014 22:12

PetualGordino

There's no need to exaggerate, I did not suggest that it was unreasonable or irrational. I was just making the point that my character and actions don't affect the quality (or lack thereof) of my argument at all. That's all.

BuffyBotRebuted

I'm ok for you to work exclusively on them, but as I've said from the very first post, I think the hatred against MRAs is completely unwarranted, and the ideal solution involves men and women working together for all gender issues. I don't see why that's such an offensive viewpoint. At the risk of making one inference too many, I think you're basing your whole views of the movement on the actions of a misogynistic minority. There's a great diversity of opinion within feminist thought, and we should accept that the same applies to other interest groups.

OP posts:
WinifredTheLostDenver · 09/09/2014 22:12

Were you trying for the "Behold, a man has arrived" picture?

Grin
PortofinoRevisited · 09/09/2014 22:12

Sorry but there is no debate nor interesting point raising to be had here. I reported OP as goady MRA type hours ago. It's a waste of oxygen and typing really. I would support a free wine for feminists campaign instead of wasting precious time on this goady fucker.

ifyourehoppyandyouknowit · 09/09/2014 22:10

Apparently I'm also too ill to check what I'm uploading because that was not what I picked. FFS.

Gives up.

scallopsrgreat · 09/09/2014 22:09

"What are you doing about global violence against women?"

This. So what are you doing about it? You seem to want us to campaign for men's 'rights'. Seems only fair you do the same for women.

AnnieLobeseder · 09/09/2014 22:07

However, it is easy to be anonymous on an online forum, so perhaps (if she had an interest in doing so but was worried about it otherwise) she could still take part in the debates.

Yup. Because, you know, it makes me feel much better about receiving rape and death threats when I'm anonymous. Hmm

LaVoixDeLaRaison · 09/09/2014 22:07

BuffyBotRebuted

I've got no problem with people being rude to me, I just think it's irrelevant and therefore has no place in this thread. Why was my congratulations repellant? I was being genuine. Would it be easier if I abandoned politeness and sunk to the level of name-calling, so that I'd more closely represent the stereotype of someone who disagrees with your opinion?

My problem with using cancer/malaria as a comparison is that it does not take into account any systematic power imbalances, it will not necessarily affect everyone, and there are more than two diseases. For those reasons I think that those sorts of comparisons are not useful.

OP posts:
BuffyBotRebooted · 09/09/2014 22:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ifyourehoppyandyouknowit · 09/09/2014 22:03

I'm too full of horror cold to contribute more than this. When it comes to MRAs.

Why are feminists so threatened by the MRA movement?
LineRunner · 09/09/2014 22:02

X posted, Petula.

LineRunner · 09/09/2014 22:01

Well exactly, who needs his approval?

PetulaGordino · 09/09/2014 22:01

I'm so sorry OP. I misunderstood you when you asked why feminists weren't working on men's rights. I thought you might at least want to let us know what you're doing for one of the biggest problems women face, which is men's violence, in the spirit of working together on issues. But I realise now that that is entirely unreasonable and irrational of me.

LaVoixDeLaRaison · 09/09/2014 22:00

SevenZarkSeven

Again, so needlessly rude. I happily admit that I missed that post, so thank you for directing my attention towards it. Now that I'm more informed, I would say that she is quite right to withdraw from such debates if she feels her personal safety is at risk. However, it is easy to be anonymous on an online forum, so perhaps (if she had an interest in doing so but was worried about it otherwise) she could still take part in the debates. I'm glad that you agree that men can be oppressed too, even if you show a disregard for the lived experiences of men who don't fit your definition of those who can be oppressed. Should feminists concern themselves with the men who you believe are oppressed?

TessOfTheFurbyvilles

Well actually some have, but not you. I agree that we can't effectively campaign for all the issues we care about, so focus on those most salient to us. Hypothetically, if you did have the time to do so, would you include campaigns for any men's issues within your feminist activism? Also, if you have no problem with people campaigning only for those issues most salient to them, what's the problem with MRAs? (I accept you might have no problem with them, but there is a lot of hatred towards them from some feminist groups, which was the point of the OP).

OP posts:
WinifredTheLostDenver · 09/09/2014 21:58

"We do not require your approval to continue working for our own liberation in the way that we see fit."

I'm getting this on a fucking T shirt.

Annie, have you got the numbers about women and girls dying each year in childbirth or in complications from childbirth such as fistulae? Or from botched abortions? Those dying from FGM, either when it's done, or when they first have sex, or when they later give birth? Those dying in India after being raped for the crime of being girls or women in the wrong place at the wrong time? Those killed by their family members for dishonouring them in some manner?

But, y'know, insurance premiums.

PetulaGordino · 09/09/2014 21:57

Thanks seven. I'm certainly not going to do it again for the benefit of someone who thinks goading feminists of an evening is a worthwhile activity

Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.

Posting is temporarily suspended on this thread.