Would You Like to Share a Prison Cell with This Person? **MNHQ edit, this post contains rather graphic material**

it is typical, and it's why so much of the work of gender critical feminists is so widely misunderstood: see janice raymond's interview in counterpunch

Andie - I just clicked on and read that article, and it contained this gem of a sentence that rather perfectly sums up how this whole issue has played out on social media:

"The book sparked a local protest that included Margaret Cerullo, a Hampshire College professor of sociology, who admited she hasn’t read the book, but nevertheless called it hurtful, containing negative stereotypes about transgender people based on excerpts she read online."

kim - none that would satisfy, i can't imagine. but having spent many years as part of the trans community, and having seen a huge number engage in innappropriate behaviour and then go on to transition when the guilt it caused them grief, and having seen many trans make unreasonable absive demands of their partners.

www.gazettenet.com/home/3191189-95/benvenuto-husband-book-gender

I think that if a male-bodied person insists on their right to access women's space and women's bodies, over the expressly stated wishes of many women, then I am going to think they are exactly the type of person who is at risk of committing a sex crime, whether they be men or trans women.

If they have a track record of respecting women's spaces and women's bodies, I will be far less likely to view them as a potential threat.

The person referred to in the OP is a sex offender though. A violent one who raped and murdered a child. So I think women should be allowed to discuss this situation and Cox's championing of a sex offender in terms of, um, sex offence. Non?

As an aside, there was a US study done on transgender people in prison with regards to how to house them safely and the stats showed that nearly half of MtT inmates are in prison for sexual offences (AKA violence against women) I don't have time just now but I'll see later if I can find the study. I don't think I bookmarked it though.

on the (possible) link between trans and sex offenders - i don't think this can be entirely disregarded. of course i know many trans people who aren't offenders, but i do think sexual dysfunction of some sort or another is fairly common. aditionally, as someone who believes trans and other more extreme/dangerous deviancy to be the result of less than ideal upbringings, would it really be beyond the realms of possibility for their to be a degree of overlap? i don't think so.

If you're going to hack my posts about, not engage with the context and then go completely off topic rather than engaging with something quite fundamental to what you brought up in the first place, then I will feel free to respond as I see fit

Wow, ok. You're really angry. I genuinely didn't mean to upset you but I obviously have. I thought we were exchanging views! Sorry!

address, even.

gin also makes a good point though. If you are trans simply by declaring yourself to be so, and male-bodied MtF trans are to be automatically given access to women-only spaces, then a very good way of getting access to women for the purposes of sexual assault is to declare yourself trans. That's a real practical problem which, it seems to me, no one but so-called TERFS is prepared to addressed.

@archeryannie - i'm not particularly concerned one way or the other :)

1st post in response to tewi there 2nd to gin

If you're going to hack my posts about, not engage with the context and then go completely off topic rather than engaging with something quite fundamental to what you brought up in the first place, then I will feel free to respond as I see fit

If I were a MTF trans person what I would take away from that link is not "hmm I need to have a good think about what labels I feel should be included under the trans unbrella" and more "Oh fuck if lots of people read this sort of thing and pay it any credence my whole life is going to be screwed and people are going to want to kill me".

Unless trans people are completely segregated off and then it wouldn't matter which prison they are attached to - the point of principle could be allowed without compromising either the main population of the prison or endangering the transperson.

I wouldn't expect a pre-operative transman to want to be housed in a male prison (would they?) and I can't conceive of insisting that they go there.

If everyone got a choice then most people would choose to go in a female prison rather than male wouldn't they? It's just shit-tons safer for a start.

Thing is that the prison system needs sorting out. Everyone in prison should be safe from violence including sexual violence.

The answer is that it is patent bollocks that "nearly 100%" of convicted sex offenders are transgender

I'm confused. How is that the answer to the questions I asked in my last paragraph - about the "transgender" label being hijacked and abused by sex offenders?

I agree with you also seven, I closed that link because I felt it was trying to paint all trans people as active sex offenders and a claim like that really needs to be backed up with substantial proof not just examples.

Of course the situation with trans sex offenders and male/female prisons is also madness. I can't see any real solutions except to create extremely small trans only prisons.

The answer is that it is patent bollocks that "nearly 100%" of convicted sex offenders are transgender.

That is blatant hatemongering.

Even using that authors extremely wide definition of transgender

No citation for the claimed "almost 100%," I see...

That being said, is it the author's definition? As far as I can tell the definition of "transgender" as used by the transgender community themselves is very inclusive and therefore very very broad.

And I think that that's a problem that the community needs to face up to and address, because at the moment "transgender" does include literally anyone who wants to call themselves transgender. Any dude who puts on a dress can say "I am transgender" and who can argue with him? The community certainly can't, and that means that they run the risk of very distorted crime stats. I have no idea what the answer is.

I mean if this isn't equating trans with sex offences then I don't know what is:

"Transgender fetish is the largest sexual disorder reported in convicted sex offenders.(4) Almost 100% of convicted sex offenders have a documented history of transvestism, crossdressing, free-dressing, Autogynephilia, transsexualism – in other words: TRANSGENDER."

That link has really dodgy stats and is implying extremely strongly that all MTF trans people are deviant sex offenders.

Even using that authors extremely wide definition of transgender, I flat out do not believe that nearly 100% of all sex offenders are transgender. That is just hatemongering bollocks, quite frankly.

Having said that I don't know what "free dressing" is - if it means "wearing clothing" then maybe the author has a point. I somehow doubt it though.

That comment was part of a wider post, which in turn was in response to a specific link. I think you need to tie in to the content of the link and why you would disagree with my comments in that context.

Not being arsey but that's one tiny line and totally out of context.

this blanket association with trans = sex crimes

I think the point is not trans=sex crimes. I think the point is that the current push for men to be given unfettered access to all women's spaces as long as they "dress like women" is a dream come true for sex offenders because all they have to do is put on a dress and they have a free pass to walk into places where women are in a state of undress and therefore vulnerable.

thanks abbie

I agree with you, SevenZarkSeven.

May I ask a personal question, andie? If you are detransitioning, do you prefer to be referred to as a man, or are you still trans (since you are still going through a process, even if in the other direction)? No worries if you'd rather not answer, but I've seen other people on social media talk about detransitioning, and wondered how they see themselves, and how they'd like others to see them.