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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Female only maths/chess competitions WTF?

145 replies

Annie11111 · 04/08/2014 08:50

I recently saw a thread on another forum on how there are female only chess competitions and even female only maths olympiads. There are also women only chess titles (international master, grandmaster etc) which require a much lower score or ranking than the default ones that any gender can earn. To me as a feminist this is a fucking insult and just goes in line with the rest of the usual ''like a girl'' bs.

It also said that boys/men make up about 99% of top chess players and maths olympiad winners in the ''proper'', mixed competitions. I didn't know if the poster was trolling but after checking it looks like he was right. It's bad enough that we have to hear about how much better men are at sports and how the best female football teams in the world lose by huge margins to half-decent teenage boys, but this isn't even sports, it's ''brainy'' stuff. I think any ''girl titles'' or competitions of this sort should be banned. How else will we ever stop thinking about girls as second best when they need to have ''special'' competitions in order to win anything? ''Sorry, hun, you can't compete with the boys in the ''proper'' leagues but here's one just for you, let's see if you're good enough for a girl!'' Unfuckingreal.

End rant, sorry!

OP posts:
scallopsrgreat · 05/08/2014 17:14

I'd love to see a quilting comp. Those women are amazing too!

CaptChaos · 05/08/2014 17:09

OMG! I missed the quilting comp.

I really wanted one of those fancy pfaff machines as well!

may only be half joking about the machine

ABlandAndDeadlyCourtesy · 05/08/2014 16:56

"I get the impression it's much less socially acceptable for a girl to be an obsessive nerd with anything - hiding in their bedroom or basement playing pool, or guitar, or chess or computing, is allowed for boys with a bit of exasperation, "

Agree.

Bangs and a Bun is a good blogger on women and sport with a fair bit of S & B thrown in.

NotCitrus · 05/08/2014 16:34

What Buffy said. I notice a lot of women on this thread refer to not wanting to compete, be noticed, put themselves forward, and was wondering what that stemmed from - parents, school teachers, other children? I think that's the source of a lot of disparity. I get the impression it's much less socially acceptable for a girl to be an obsessive nerd with anything - hiding in their bedroom or basement playing pool, or guitar, or chess or computing, is allowed for boys with a bit of exasperation, but more effort is put into jollying girls into socialization.

And making those opportunities available to all. A chess set is a quid, but how many six tear old girls versus boys have been taught to play?

scallopsrgreat · 05/08/2014 16:34

If we are insisting on comparing men and women's sport then there is also the factor of how women have been excluded from sport for centuries and it is only relatively recently that they have been allowed to compete in anything like the same arena as men. That has various legacy effects including the misogyny that allowed it to happen in the first place.

In certain sports there are no moves towards parity in events, funding etc and in others any moves are still being actively blocked.

There are also no moves to make sport more mixed. There are plenty of opportunities in many sports to have high class mixed events e.g. rowing, canoeing, sailing even team sports.

And you have to remember that top class women in their sport will beat 95% of the male population (at least), not because they are 'stronger' than them but because of technique and specific training. These women are amazing.

But we have quilting. For that I am grateful Grin

PetulaGordino · 05/08/2014 16:25

sorry morphine, was being picky! i think it's difficult to generalise about single or mixed sex events because there are nuances to all these things, and opening up competition to women might need more effort in some areas than others

PetulaGordino · 05/08/2014 16:22
BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 05/08/2014 16:18

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MorphineDreams · 05/08/2014 16:12

Sorry petula using 'we' was quite lazy of me!

PetulaGordino · 05/08/2014 16:11

i don't think there's a "we" morphine - the thread is broadly supportive of female-only competition, but not everyone does and others are more on the fence. i don't think there's a consensus really

PetulaGordino · 05/08/2014 16:08

what kind of race buffy? land, sea, air?

MorphineDreams · 05/08/2014 16:08

I don't think we can have it both ways though.

We don't like this, yet we were praising the females only competition to work with NASA. (or something along those lines)

BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 05/08/2014 16:05

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 05/08/2014 16:05

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ABlandAndDeadlyCourtesy · 05/08/2014 15:00

Sisters, I'm afraid I have some terrible news.

The vast majority of awards in this international quilting competition were won by WOMEN last year.

www.quilts.org/winners.html

The prizes range from $50 to $10,000 and the sponsors include the world-famous firms Superior Threads and Pfaff Sewing Machines. In 2013, a total of $95,500 in non-purchase cash prizes was awarded to winners, with travel/hotel prizes going to the top seven winners.

This isn't even caring responsibilities, it's "dexterity" stuff. WTF?

scallopsrgreat · 05/08/2014 14:55

Why do you feel the need to compare men and women in sport?

ABlandAndDeadlyCourtesy · 05/08/2014 14:55

BranchingOut, I wish that were true - I've been at Wimbledon and courts tend to empty out during women's matches. But I agree, at least there is equal television time and court time (within the fact the Grand Slams allow 5 setters for men but only 3 setters for women, grr)

BranchingOut · 05/08/2014 14:36

I haven't read all of the thread, but I think that the only way to get more balance in sport is to have women-only competitions, but televised and broadcast alongside men's competitions.

The level of interest in the Wimbledon women's tennis is almost equal to the interest in the men's tennis - because the matches are played alongside each other - which is so much better than many other sports.

BranchingOut · 05/08/2014 14:32

I have said it on here before, but I am looking forward to the day when a female F1 driver ascends a set of stairs to the winner's podium, walking past an attractive young man in tight clothing standing applauding her on every step of the staircase...Grin.

I saw this exact scenario, in reverse, during one of Fernando Alonso's wins a few years ago.

ABlandAndDeadlyCourtesy · 05/08/2014 13:59

I like the sound of your voice too, Capt. So... mwah!

CaptChaos · 05/08/2014 13:33

Why would you envy something that I was trained to do? That I trained 6 days a week to be good enough to do? I played rugby at international level, I also trained in Chinese boxing, where I competed against people my own size and bigger, male and female, sometimes I won, sometimes I lost, sometimes I was hurt, sometimes I hurt people.

I do understand that you want to continue in your obvious belief that men are better than women. And, in some circumstances, they are. However, women's sport is not not shown on TV because it's shite, or boring, or less skillful in some way, but because the male owners of TV stations, who have the power to buy licences to show all matches, don't think people want to see it.

Because women's sport is not shown on TV, there are fewer sponsors for it, because sponsors don't give their money to teams or individuals for shits and giggles, they give it to them so that they can use them for advertising, less exposure, less advertising revenue, less sponsorship money.

Because there is less sponsorship money to go around, top female athletes either have to have VERY supportive families, who are prepared to shell out for travel, costumes/strip, medical cover etc etc etc or they have to work around their sporting commitments. This could mean that there is less money around for the amount of food you have to eat, for time with family, for a life outside work/your sport.

I know, I know, you will still think that men are just simply 'better' at sport, chess, everything than women, no matter what I or anyone else says. But I like the sound of my own voice, so.... meh! Grin

ABlandAndDeadlyCourtesy · 05/08/2014 12:53

Once upon a time you could have said "why are all the top tuba players male" - then a German orchestra introduced auditioning behind a screen and lo and behold, women were suddenly "good enough" to join the orchestra.

Or maybe they were good enough all along but the people able to make the decisions about who got a spot (....attention, funding, training etc) had pre-conceived notions about sex and breath control...

TheSameBoat · 05/08/2014 12:48

Annie, I'm not sure what the answer is then, because how can you tell if men's superiority at competition is down to testosterone making them quicker and better under pressure or down to stereotype threat and society's expectations of them.

But either way it doesn't make them better at the actual thing. Interesting about the Scrabble because amongstmy friends it's the women who generally excel.However the idea of a public competition would petrify me and I'm sure I'd be rubbish.

I feel that somehow you are trying to make women fit into a man shaped hole. Judging women within a framework set up by men. It's natural. We all do it.

SevenZarkSeven · 05/08/2014 12:42

Annie I don't think you really understood my post did you :)

I also think that spanning the fwr boards with multiple threads which taken together have an agenda is a bit off really.

I can see you are interested in trying to make the women here agree with your perception that women are intellectually and physically inferior to men and at the same time advantaged above them by society. Many of the women on here are unlikely to agree with you. You might have done better with one, more subtle thread rather than so many and all with the same theme.

Anyway. If you want to learn more about women and extreme distance running, Google it and read some articles in running magazines. I would link but difficult on this device. It is a very interesting topic which turns some accepted ideas about male vs female physicality on their heads. I somehow doubt you are actually interested though.

PetulaGordino · 05/08/2014 12:37
Sad
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