New campaign to allow partners to stay on maternity wards.

OldLady, no way would I have wanted anyone (not even my DP) to take my baby away from me whilst I stayed in hospital. It would have greatly distressed me. I was breastfeeding anyway so it wouldn't have been a possibility, but I would have absolutely hated that idea.

Lighthouse keeping are you at kings college hospital?

I 'll read this properly when I finish my shift. Just to say that it's been going on at my place for a year now do I don't know why it's a campaign? It's not new in London.

See I think what is needed is a radical rethink of how maternity centres are set up. I'd much rather see individual rooms for women to birth and recover in so that partners can stay overnight.

Fair enough, TheDetective, it's almost 24 years since I last gave birth so am not totally au fait with modern ways. (Even then, I went in Saturday morning to be induced, it failed, labour started "naturally" in the small hours of Sunday, gave birth around breakfast time and went home Monday lunchtime.) It's just that all of these stories of catheters, spinal blocks, women unable to walk or care for their newborn etc made me wonder if it wouldn't be better if the (healthy, non bf) baby went home when the father did, allowing the mother some recovery time and reducing stress in the ward. I totally accept that these may be minority experiences.

When I had ds1, (1987) I was asked if I was going to bf or ff. I had chosen ff; in those days, ff babies were taken to the hospital nursery at night, where they would be fed, changed, cuddled etc, and the new mum got to sleep a bit more. I really appreciated this as we'd both nearly died, I had massive blood loss and no access to transfusion; Edinburgh at the height of the AIDS thing. Still went home after three nights, exhausted.

TheDetective, it is really unfortunate that this is the case. I would support a campaign to better fund and staff post natal wards in a heart beat. Anything to help you make your workload easier.

And it's often the case that selfish and thoughtless people are the ones that won't be told by others.

The solution isn't to allow partners to stay overnight in wards where there aren't private rooms with en suite bathrooms.

This is why the right to self discharge is a wonderful thing, I hate hospitals I have severe anxiety about them. I don't trust the staff I become quite snippy and sarcastic basically a horrible cow to deal with.

I know in 4/5 weeks time I will have to grace the doors of a dirty NHS mrsa filled hospital full of sick people, needles and overstretched staff, however I will be somewhat eased and spured on by a loving DP.

I need my DP by my side to survive hospital, but I won't do it to the detriment of other women. I just won't stay in the hospital. I don't think I have ever been officially released from hospital I constantly self discharge as soon as I feel I can. Even when I went in to preterm labour, once labor was stalled I had my steroid injections and was no longer in any pain or disco.fort and was happy that baby was fine, I discharged myself, they wanted me there another 24 hours...wasn't going to happen.

So I will do the same after my birth if I think me and more importantly baby are well enough, I'm not staying.I can lay in bed at home not surrounded by staff and strangers and let DP help.

It's extremely difficult and time consuming to enforce sadly. We do try, but people don't like being told no. And the arguments we get just take us away from caring for women and babies.

If there was someone who could go around and do this, great! But there isn't (2 midwives and one support staff if you are lucky to a 20 plus bedded ward). And really, it shouldn't have to be policed! People shouldn't take the mick!

I truly believe that general visiting should be kept to a bare minimum eg. grandparents only. Most are home in a day or two, and visiting can begin in abundance.

My stay on the post natal ward was hideous. Made massively worse by thoughtless and selfish visitors during the day. It was a huge relief when all the visitors had to go home. Even though that included my DP. I could cope during visitors hours as my DP could help me out and defend me.

I didn't and don't understand why the staff don't enforce their own rules about numbers of visitors, use of mobile phones, other children, use of the facilities by non-patients etc etc.

When I was moved to the transitional care ward there were 4 bays. During visitors hours one of the other women's partners would arrive, plonk himself at the shared table area in front of the TV and just sit there, for hours. He would be looking around and just there all the time. Didn't seem to be interested in his partner or the baby and certainly not really helping her. I had to troop past him all the time to use the sink, to go to the loo, to go and wash/sterilise pumping equipment etc etc. I found it really unnerving. My DP would stay in our bay with the curtain mostly drawn and not get in the way of the other women. Again, when the partners
had to go home I felt a great sense of relief. Sometimes it's appropriate for there to be a time and a space that is just a female time/space.

Italksense, btw, just represents MNHQ failure to deal with trolls on FWR.

But many women may not feel safe around the vast majority of men who are strangers to them. Let's face it, we're socialised that way from girlhood. We're told not to go out alone, late at night, to get taxis etc- what is that advice protecting us from? Strange men of course.

1 in 4 women (at least) have been sexually or raped by men - it is not unreasonable to not want them there, right next to you, when you've just given birth.

I have read the linked thread but only after I clicked on this one. I don't think men looking at breasts is the only issue I was being flippant. I do however think the vast majority of men are safe to be around women.

Because she didn't read it?

It's a complex issue. But my overwhelming feeling both as a mother and as staff is that it wouldn't work in the current set up of many hospitals. It would only work when the entire ward was single rooms.

I've had too many difficult situations such as men provided with a chair, who have then been found either in the bed with the woman (unacceptable for reasons which include infection control, the woman's comfort and recovery and preventing staff from carrying out their duties by being in a hospital bed!!) or in the bed on their own with women in the chair! Which was just unbelievable!

Men who have been told to remain in the single room have been found wandering around the wards, helping themselves to patients tea/coffee facilities, using bathrooms which are for patient use, going in to wrong rooms, buzzing in and out the door all night going out smoking etc.

I have to say, women having a female companion would be of much more use. Although that still gives the same issues with extra bodies on already over cramped and understaffed wards. 4 beds, 4 cots, 4 extra stayers. That's 12 people in a bay which would house 4 on the general side...

I do think having support is important, but not to the detriment of everyone else. At the moment, desperate underfunding means that this wouldn't be possible in many places without infringing on the rights of other people.

OldLady most mums are fit for discharge fairly soon (within 12 hours) of birth. Most extended stays are due to the baby needing observation or treatment rather than for maternal reasons. So i think your point would be irrelevant in most cases. Even women who have had a c/s can go after 24 hours.

Although it's worrh mentioning that sometimes mums are readmitted with complications. A lot of mums chose to leave their babies at home with Dad unless they are breastfed. So babies can be left at home when mum is on the postnatal ward.

SoonToBeSix have you read the thread started by MNHQ (linked in the OP)? it's not just on FWR that people have concerns about the campaign

i'm not sure though how you've got the impression from this thread that breast ogling is the only objection anyway

I clicked on this thread thinking on all my time on mumsnet I actually agree with a thread on the feminist board. But sadly no. Those pesky men wouldn't be supporting their partners at all, of course not they would be peeping through the curtains trying to at ogle at another woman's breasts.

I don't support the campaign because it isn't fair on other patients. that's the bit I agree with^^

It's not fair on recovering women and the father's rights or desires are not as important as the mothers recovering from birth.

scotchtikidoll- fair enough. I agree with you.

What would people think about healthy, non-bf babies being sent home with their father (aiding bonding, lessening the notion that childcare is a "woman thing") while mothers rest in hospital for a day or two? Baby could be brought in during (long) visiting hours, and/or those wanting to meet the new baby could do so in baby's home, reducing stress for women left on the wards.

You weren't, I didn't exactly word what I was saying perfectly. It's really hard not to offend people unless you iron-clad what you say

Scotch, sorry. I didn't mean to be rude.

almond

What I said was 'I'm now thinking about single mums who would at least be glad to get that choice at all.'

I did not say 'all single mums.'

I've accepted I was thinking selfishly, and that I've learned from experience and reading from the threads, that in future, that because I want my partner there most of the time, then I'll need to pay for it without affecting anybody else.

MissBattleAxe I'm not actually complaining about the fact he didn't get to stay over any more- I was just responding to Bill. My other posts indicate that I've mulled this over and realised that it isn't the best idea to have OH's on the ward after all, even though I needed mine. Other people are to be considered too- what I am going to do next time is save up and get a private room (homebirth medically not an option for me), because it does mean a lot having him there, but obviously not at the expense of other people's dignity and comfort and of course the NHS. I don't support the campaign because it isn't fair on other patients.

Scotch, it isn't about whether your partners feelings are as valid as yours, it is that your partners feelings are not as valid as those of the other patients on that ward.

They have to be there. Your partner does not.

Your posts do make it sound like a bit of a romance novel TBH. Not all single mothers do wish they were in your position and had the 'choice' of a partner staying. A lot of people legitimately are quite happy to have babies in totally different family structures - single mothers, extended families, surrogates etc.

A closely bonded unit of you, your DP and a baby is something you want. It isn't something hospitals are there to promote or make the norm. Maternity care is provided for the health and well being of mothers.