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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Why has the trans/sex/gender debate emerged at this moment?

182 replies

UptheChimney · 06/07/2014 08:31

That's it: what is at stake that this argument/attack on feminists from trans people has emerged at this moment?

As a late 70s feminist, my experience of trans issues was that there was huge discrimination for those who didn't fit into heteronormativity, and I could see how lesbian & gay people had much in common with trans people. And with feminists.

Solidaritry wasn't uniform: while lesbian feminism was very strong, gay men were pretty misogynist and elements of the male gay movement still are the non-monogamous etc etc versions of "gay lifestyles" are pretty masculinist in a very unreconstructed way: the idea that men are driven by sex, and should have the freedom to have sex when/where/whatever. But that's another thread.

So what are the views on why this battle between trans people and some feminists? Is it another "What about teh menz?" Is it because women are expected simply to care about everyone else?

Ideas? Views?

OP posts:
TiggyD · 06/07/2014 12:52

I think there comes a time for all minorities/oppressed group where they go from keeping quiet and keeping their heads down to being happy/proud to be what they are. Suffragettes, Rosa Parks, the original Stonewall, gay prides, etc. I think the internet helps bring people together from these groups, but I think trans people were always due to burst forth from the shadows around now.

BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 06/07/2014 12:46

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CaptChaos · 06/07/2014 12:06

I agree with Buffy but would add that the explosion into public consciousness of the MRA agenda has also helped. MRAs were the main protagonists imo with the Radfem 2013 drama, and they co-opted trans*activists into their row.

There are men and women out there in internet land who truly hate and fear feminists, they now have a platform and a group to use as a front.

BuffytheReasonableFeminist · 06/07/2014 12:02

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DoctorTwo · 06/07/2014 11:11

My reading of it is that at RadFem 2013 there were some transactivists who demanded access, which was denied. At the time I thought that was wrong, but having had nearly a year to think and read about it I've changed my mind. There are a few reasons for this change: the need for women only spaces, the danger of 'uninvited penis', the fact that these transwomen were raised as boys with all that entails, so male privilege, entitlement etc.

Also, if transactivists are allowed to derail feminism then it's a win for patriarchy. Obviously this is only my opinion, not fact, so...

Transactivists are demanding access to women only spaces, they're also insisting that transwomen who identify a lesbians have access to lesbians' bodies, and those lesbians who won't fuck them, which is all of them because, durr, penis, are bigots and haterz. They point out that some lesbians use strap ons and dildos during sex and ask why not a penis? completely disregarding the fact that a penis is completely different to a strap on, and the lesbians who I know don't want to be near a penis.

I've probably oversimplified things, but somebody or bodies will come and correct me or expand on my outline.

Safeinourbubble · 06/07/2014 09:18

The chapter in Andrew Solomon's book "Far from the Tree" on transgender children was one of the saddest and hardest to read. The inhumanity and lack of compassion he described was horrifying.

Sometimes these things appear almost random - the same argument will have been put forward before but not got the publicity. Some people seem to revel in a level of incoherence. Lots of us generalise from our own experiences and misinterpret the bigger picture. Some people are just ignorant and while they have a right to speech, that does not mean I have to take them seriously. Now if the media does, what does that say?

Hazchem · 06/07/2014 09:06

I'd be interested to know others thoughts on this too. I can't offer any idea or information.