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Original poster

We need a Bechdel test for music.

43 replies

kickassangel · 06/07/2014 08:24

My suggested rules are:

  1. Written by, or performed by a woman.
  2. Not about love or wanting a partner or how good looking someone is.
  3. Must not contain disrespectful tropes (e.g. The woman who tricked a man by looking so good but acting so bad)

I can't think of many but would suggest

Madonna, Holiday or Dance

Or Mariah Carey Dance with somebody

Or Cyndi Lauper Girls just wanna have fun

There are probably others about wanting to dance. This is a bit tricky as they often imply with somebody, or the while girls look nice but really are jay naughty minxes, but I am having to stretch a point here.

OP posts:
callamia · 06/07/2014 13:27

Buffalo Stance.

enderwoman · 06/07/2014 11:26

I think there are a lot of good songs about not taking shit from a man. Off the top of my head
Destiny's Child - Survivor
TLC- No Scrubs
Destiny's Child - Bugaboo

My contribution to your test
Girl on Fire - Alicia Keys
Mean- Taylor Swift
Let it go - Frozen
Firework , Roar , Part of Me- Katy Perry
Beautiful- Christina Aguilera

sausageeggbacon11 · 06/07/2014 11:07

Hell is for children by Pat Benatar strong song about child abuse.

However realistically 90% of music would fail because music is about emotion and life experiences in general and the strongest one we have in common is love.

BillnTedsMostFeministAdventure · 06/07/2014 10:20

I Will Survive, then?!?!

callamia · 06/07/2014 10:09

Joni Mitchell's Little Green.
Great Things by Echobelly
Devil Gate Drive by Suzie Quatro?

I'm going to get to work in thinking of more...

Hazchem · 06/07/2014 10:05

Also thinking about it don't think we have to discount love songs because depending on how they are emoted they can actually be a rally cry for holding yourself together and stepping either into love (which can be scary) or stepping away from love.

Hazchem · 06/07/2014 10:01

Oh I think so. actually I think quite a lot of Bjork would fit.

What about TLC, Salt n Pepa, Eve, Christine Anu, Nina simone - strange fruit, young gifted and black, I got my...

In fact I think part of it is I mainly listen to female singers because I like the sound of female singing

BillnTedsMostFeministAdventure · 06/07/2014 09:54

Let England Shake by PJ Harvey
Winter by Tori Amos

Can I have "It's Oh So Quiet" by bjork? I know it's about love but it's about the emotion of falling in love not about a partner.

Hazchem · 06/07/2014 09:51

Joni Mitchell Big yellow taxi but there must be loads
Janis Joplin Mercedes Benz
Joan armatrading?
Tracy Chapman ?
The Bangles
But yes I agree with Billnted I think loads of blokes songs would fail the reverse

BillnTedsMostFeministAdventure · 06/07/2014 09:38

I think a lot of songs would fail the reverse Bechdel, unlike a lot of films, as so many pop songs are about love/sex.

I will think..

Hazchem · 06/07/2014 09:33

Also bands like hole, L7 and lots of the 90s grrl groups would count pass.
Worryingly I think katy perry would pass a fair bit. Lorde royals would pass. Sisters doing it for themselves would pass.
Lots of annie lennox, density child,

DoctorTwo · 06/07/2014 09:19

I like Warpaint. I saw them on the BBC's coverage of Glastonbury and they were super.

Hazchem · 06/07/2014 09:13

I've been listening to The Waifs today and they are a band so have a male female vocal but the women sing and play a lot. Almost all the songs I listened to form them today are not about love. or if it is almost political. The song Bridal Train is about Australian war brides leaving to go to America after WW2.

At least one of Emilee Sandee songs would count.

Would any of Dolly partons or Patsy cline How about kd lang

AnathemaDevice · 06/07/2014 09:01

Lots of Bikini Kill's sings would pass your test, but they're not exactly easy on the ears (I love Bikini Kill/Kathleen Hanna, but I'm the first to admit that they're an aquired taste!)

Hot Topic by Le Tigre (another Kathleen Hanna fronted band)

I think some of Lily Allen's songs would pass this too.

StealthPolarBear · 06/07/2014 08:49

Loads of Kate bush I expect, running up that hill?
Little bird by Annie lennox
That little mix song about flying (if Simon Crowell on the background doesn't ruin it!)

Original poster
kickassangel · 06/07/2014 08:43

Well the point us to see what proportion of movies/music pass the test as an indicator of the messages sent out in popular media.

So I'd say about 25% pass would be OK as you'd expect a lot of songs to be about love and half sung by men.

But I doubt even 5% fit.

OP posts:
AuntieStella · 06/07/2014 08:33

The test for films is far from perfect, and I'm not sure it works on short songs. And is hugely confounded by the tendency for singles to be the soundtrack for courtship behaviour. But I'll give it a shot.

I'd look to place it within the context of a performer's total work.

(I'd also look back a bit, to when there was more passion/politics in pop).

X Ray Spex - in particular "Oh Bondage Up Yours"
The Slits

Original poster
kickassangel · 06/07/2014 08:28

Sorry. Meant Madonna Get into the groove (listening to one song and writing about another) although te boy gotta prove his love so I guess it prob doesn't count.

Am I being too strict?

OP posts: