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This is fucking disgraceful (Daily Mail)

209 replies

rootypig · 26/05/2014 16:09

Daily Mail is framing a teenage girl as being at the root of the Santa Barbara shootings, because she 'teased' the perpetrator (according to his 'manifesto'). They have posted pictures of her (with her face pixelated, some concession), in varying states of undress, of course (bikinis, short shorts, things that best fit the narrative).

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2639555/Meet-model-named-Santa-Barbara-killer-reason-saw-women-mean-cruel-heartless-creatures.html

I loathe them already, but this has shocked me. The poor girl. How can they get away with this?

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rootypig · 29/05/2014 13:45

People really seem to struggle to get their head around that though.

"people" are trying to express their beliefs and engender change, rather than just be told what to do.

Of course the PCC has so covered itself in glory, we must all bow before its code.

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rootypig · 29/05/2014 13:42

Hi cat Smile. I was slightly surprised by the response and emphasis on privity, for want of a better term, though now it makes sense, in terms of an anti-floodgate type policy.

Am thinking about public interest - though it's widely invoked in the law, definitions are not forthcoming. This is presumably extra judicial since PCC is self regulating, but limiting freedom of expression is permitted under the following heads in Art 10 ECHR:

  • necessary and proportionate limitation
  • to pursue a legitimate aim, namely
o the interests of national security, territorial integrity or public safety; o the prevention of disorder or crime; o the protection of health or morals; o the protection of the reputation or rights of others; o preventing the disclosure of information received in confidence; or o maintaining the authority and impartiality of the judiciary.

So I suppose I will borrow this structure and write back to them to say that I think that it is proportionate, and that it is necessary to protect certainly the reputation and rights of this individual (though that must collapse into defamation) and the rights of women as a group under Art 14 (prohibition of discrimination).

I agree wholeheartedly with you that the article belittles women, and legitimises disregarding and targeting women, but I have zero faith that they will agree or take is seriously.

I have had a quick scout about for some Art 10 cases for suppor but the law seems very scattered and undeveloped inforrm.wordpress.com/2011/01/20/court-of-human-rights-five-recent-article-10-cases/.

I suspect the type of journalism we are talking about is too nebulous and insidious to be accommodated within its framework, which is geared toward specific incidents, rather than a culture.

www.echr.coe.int/Documents/FS_Hate_speech_ENG.pdf

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TheWholeOfTheSpoon · 29/05/2014 13:39

I haven't read the link, but is the woman in question the daughter of an 80's pop star? Because if so, it's highly unlikely her family will complain to the PCC seeing as they spoke to the Mail in the first place.

Nancy66 · 29/05/2014 13:31

Sure but pretty easy to understand once you go online and read it I'd have thought

PetiteRaleuse · 29/05/2014 13:22

Well that's understandable nancy it is rarely spoken of really. Other than the current changes.

Nancy66 · 29/05/2014 13:07

Exactly. The code is very specific. People really seem to struggle to get their head around that though.

PetiteRaleuse · 29/05/2014 13:06

I'm not defending them btw. I loathe the Mail. I thought the Miliband furore might have an effect and open people's eyes a bit but I was, evidently, naive.

PetiteRaleuse · 29/05/2014 13:04

The thing is they didn't break any actual rules. You can email them lots of opinions on the culture they are fostering but as long as no rules are broken they won't give a shiny shit.

The only thing that will work is if people stop reading, linking, clicking.

But that won't happen because they know their audience and don't care what a minority of readers think.

thecatfromjapan · 29/05/2014 12:57

Hello rootypig - I have the the same e-mail.

Do you think there is any mileage in me e-mailing to explain that i think "public interest" is not served by an article like this because it adds to a climate where violence against women is made tolerable and acceptable. Smile

I might try that, just for the heck of it. When you actually think about it, that is just what it does, and it should be completely unacceptable. It is completely Alice-through-the-looking-glass that this is not a truth universally acknowledged ...

rootypig · 29/05/2014 12:53

Ah yes, after which we will all disappear into the sucking hole in the fabric of the universe Hmm

Or.... IPSO will take over all existing complaints and the press will still do what it likes

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Nancy66 · 29/05/2014 12:47

The PCC cease operating at the end of the month though

rootypig · 29/05/2014 11:57

Response from the PCC

Dear Ms X

Thank you for contacting the Press Complaints Commission.

The concerns you have raised relate directly to the unnamed individual, the subject of the story. Given the nature of the story, it appears that it would be difficult for the Commission to investigate or understand this matter fully without their involvement. In addition, the outcome of a Commission investigation (whether correction, apology or adjudication, for example) would need their approval. In such circumstances, we would generally require a complaint from the unnamed individual or their representative, in order to take the matter forward.

If you believe, however, that there are exceptional public interest reasons for the Commission to proceed with an independent complaint under the circumstances, we would be grateful to hear from you in the next seven days.

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RyvitaBerry · 28/05/2014 23:57

and the french still say 'cherchez la femme' whenever there's a barney.

WhentheRed · 28/05/2014 22:08

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TheFarceAndTheSpurious · 28/05/2014 21:57

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PacificDogwood · 28/05/2014 20:59

Good point, 22honey

22honey · 28/05/2014 14:49

'Yes, it must be a women's fault that this man was pushed over the edge.'

This is a widely held belief I must say. Anytime a man does something bad or wrong, there is a large vocal minority of people insisting there must be a woman behind it somewhere. It does seem certain people like to just blame women for everything.

22honey · 28/05/2014 14:47

'How many mass shootings have been carried out by young, disenfranchised females because they felt rejected by somebody they fancied?'

Has anyone actually done this before because they couldn't get a partner/sex? If so that is rather worrying. Why is it such a massive deal to some people? Being single is rather relaxing and fun.

nicename · 28/05/2014 13:27

She had been tried and convicted by some already. Her life is pretty much ruined atm. But then she will probably write a book, go on daytime telly, be a telly sleb... Such is life with todays media.

I can't get my head around how someone who has been identified as having issues from childhood and been seeing professionals could plan and execute this. Would this have happened if his family had stayed in the UK - I feel quite probably not (I know we've had our outrages here too).

MissBlake · 28/05/2014 11:12

I agree nicename,

I am disgusted that anyone could make excuses for him, the man killed multiple people but we still have people trying to blame bullying ect? Surely its dangerous that this stuff keeps being pumped into the (tiny) minds of mail readers. When will they take some responsibility for their articles?

I can't believe a newspaper would publish an article blaming a woman who knew the man when she was 10. She must be feeling dreadful but the mail has decided she deserves it because she knew this man in childhood. Are they blaming he for not giving him what he "needed" at the time?

Yes, it must be a women's fault that this man was pushed over the edge. It is totally crazy to expect him to take responsibility.

AskBasil · 28/05/2014 09:03

Apparently he was going to carry out this attack last Autumn but he broke his arm or leg or something so he had to put it off.

It really wasn't someone snapping, you're quite right.

nicename · 28/05/2014 08:51

He murdered his 3 (male) dorm mates too - planned it and knifed them. This isn't someone snapping. This is a carefully planned out scheme which mustve taken a long time to put together.

He wrote his ramblings so that... Why exactly? Who knows what was going on in that head. His therapist obviously didn't. He was seeing therapists from childhood? And what exectly was their diagnosis/'help'?

Gun culture, egocentric entitlement culture, sexist culture, blame the victim and not the criminal culture, and a 'therapy and self help' culture. What a bloody mess.

BillnTedsMostFeministAdventure · 28/05/2014 08:43

Softener is a waste of money.

PBPs are a waste of time.

The silver birch is a pretty tree.

Spot the non sequitur.

LumpySpacedPrincess · 28/05/2014 08:18

It does make you so angry doesn't it murky. The hatred that some of the media show towards women, the casual sexism, the entitled arrogant behaviour of swathes of males across the internet Make. Me. Sick.

If you are on twitter have a look at the #YesAllWomen hashtag.

Not that it will do anything but I have complained about the article.

munkysea · 27/05/2014 22:20

Apparently if you read his ramblings, the girl (use that word because she was a child when it happened) barely spoke to him. Apparently he doesn't even state what she did that made him have that reaction, just that she was 'mean' to him.

So, off the back of a child of 10 saying something a bit mean or disparaging, this boy developed a hatred and didn't grow out of it and decided that women (and the men who were more likely to attract them) deserved to be killed. And the media is portraying this young woman as having a role in it. Unbelievable.

I don't think I can articulated how angry this whole affair makes me. This entitled brat took other peoples' lives because he couldn't control women's bodies. He didn't want friendship, he didn't want a relationship, he told himself that he deserved women's bodies and that they should come running to him, and he hated them for not doing this.