Justifying long term SAHM to DDs?

Does address the irritation many readers must feel at being patronised half to death by besuited professionals on good incomes, though.

Well said what?it doesn't address that some women don't return and men carry on work unencumbererd

Well said combusti

The option of going back to work isn't there for veryone though. I live in a village with many families on the minimum wage. Of those it's only the familes with grandparent childcare support who can afford to have both parents working.

We do have nurseries and childminders but these tend to be used by slightlier wealthier families.
I don't know of any woman living in social housing who pays for childcare while she works. Paying a nanny or childminder is simply unaffordable while a parent is earning a minimum wage.

Sorry that should say LinkedIn groups.

Re your comment yesterday Scarlett about attitudes of men with / without working wives to working mums. There has been a study on that which was linked to on one of the linked professional women's groups I belong to. (maybe everywoman?). It basically found that men with kids and wives at home were less likely to promote women, want to work for women or even work in organisations that showed women in varied roles in their recruitment ads. They just could not see that a sahm being best for them did not mean it was best for everyone. My experience has been the best bosses are men with no kids or working wives and other working women. Although friends have said worst boss for a part time wohm is a full time wohm. Men where the women work part time but do all pick ups, sick cover etc aren't always that great either! DP works for a top x employer, very flexible to women returners, has women's network etc, but senior.management is mostly male and he gets raised eyebrows for leaving early to pick up kids.

Of course I pick the kids up from school.after school
And I demonstrate don't be dependent on another adult,by working.
I demonstrate women in employment,by career.its not inevitable that women give things up for men or family.there is another way that both share the responsibilities,or if you're solvent you buy additional support

I wasn't addressing you particularly little

fideline, don't worry, I have just realised the app has a hide button. Happy days.

I don't think little sounds bitter at all tbh. Pissed off at double standards and hypocrisy, but not bitter.

To be honest, if I had been in her situation I would be quite fucked off too.

No, I am not bitter. Annoyed at what I have read on here in the name of intelligent debate by supposedly educated people, maybe. Annoyed at trite cliches which show no insight into other people's situations. Etc.

Sad, too, that the question why have kids if you don't see them applies to DD's dad and gm. But not bitter. Having DD was the best thing that ever happened to me. Imagine a light that shines of the kindest, most beautiful person and that person comes into your life. How could I ever be bitter?

But annoyed, upset, sad, yes, at the suggestion that there was no reason for me to have her when I was just pregnant and annoyed that this phrase is still brought out. I think I am allowed to express that without being termed bitter. It is shit.

Oh FFS

Is this the best we can manage?

You sound very bitter littleseahorse.

No, vest, children need a roof over their heads and food on the table. They need clothes. Someone has to pay for that.

The person who looks after DD at the end of the school day has known her for five years and will be part of our lives for many more years to come. I am actually glad that DD has someone outside the family who she can chat away to.

It takes a village to raise a child, surely. Lots of people to be there in different capacities.

To the point on why have kids if you are just going to work, the first time I heard that was from my (now ex) MIL, when I was expecting DD. You know what, her dad then met someone else and went off with OW when DD was a baby. Luckily, I had been working and I then got a better job. DD's father saw her the sum total of an hour a week and he went five years without paying maintenance. I worked, commuted, paid the nursery fees, clothed DD, everything. I'm betting that his mother did not say a word of why did her son have DC if that was what he was going to do? And guess what, I lived five miles down the road, do you reckon I saw the ex-MIL from one month to the next. No, of course not. Hypocrisy from start to finish.

I don't need to be there at pick up though vest, the after school club do pick up

Wow. How sad that some people are so keen to prove who they are that they forget what their children need. I don't give a monkeys whether it is the Mum or the Dad who is there at the end of school, but I think one of you should be. As I have always earned less than my husband, that person is me. I enjoy my time with my children and know that they are learning lots from me and benefiting from my education and experience. When they are older I will be back at work.

Jo, whilst I agree wholeheartedly with most of your post, one thing you mentioned did stand out for me - you mentioned that it was mostly women, not men, who were judgemental about you choosing to stay at home.

As a working mother, judgements re my choice to work have come primarily from men (usually those whose wives chose to stay at home), as well as women (who have chosen to stay at home).

I would argue that far more judgment is still made on those women who choose to (not need to) return to work with young children (pre school age), than those who stay at home.

I've only read the first few pages of this thread. Children learn many lessons from their parents - some choose the same path, some choose a radically different one, some chooose parts that they enjoyed.

My mother left school at 14, was married at 15, first child at 16. She had 7 children, a hard life. I was number 7, the first in my family to go to university (my nearest brother and I the first to finish school), the first to speak a foreign language, to travel outside my home country, you get the picture. I wanted to stay at home with my children, but I wanted to work, travel, discover life first. My mother gave me a love of knowledge, and a love of discovery. That was a great gift.

I travelled, I worked, I discovered things. I volunteered with children's groups, I volunteered as a Special Constable. I worked in low-paid jobs and high-paid jobs. I had relationships which didn't work out and figured out what sort of relationship I would like, and eventually found that.

Right now I am not working, right now I am a SAHP. My partner really does 50% of the childcare, and it's great, it's one of the attitudes I looked for in a potential partner.

I am not defined by my choice of lifestyle, just as I was not defined by my job earlier. I worked before, I'll probably work again when my child is older. I have found other women much more judgmental about my choice to stay at home with my child than I have found men to be. I thought feminism was about choice? Supporting a woman's right to make choices for her life? Not tearing apart other people because they have made different choices than you yourself have made?

Unfortunately not Red, not satire at all.

It's a shame because I was hoping that things were moving towards how it is up to both parents to demonstrate and practice equal work/home life responsibility. How a woman 'choosing to stay at home to allow her husband to be successful in his career' can be counter productive to increasing equality and fairer working conditions for women, thus allowing us all to truly have a 'choice' as the playing field could be levelled more between the sexes.

Alas, it seems like the only answer is "I prove I love my kids because I pick them up from school every day".
There is actually no rational answer to that mind set imo.

Well it is When because if you give up everything to be there there has to be some sort of payback - doesn't there ??
Unless both parents are actively involved and care for their children equally and enable each other to have both equality in caring and working roles.
Whhhoa Nelly- they don't like that

vest yes my DC had a parent to pick them up everyday - sometimes me ,sometimes DP- because children often ( not always) have 2 parents.

DaVinci my Dc are the way more PC - they know DP is better at cleaning ( true) and I am better at everything

Agreed vestandknickers. My children feel lucky to have had me at home when they came home from school.

Except that ds1 has the perfect picture of equality in front of him at home! Both of us work, both of us are involved in parenting, hw etc... Actually DH probably has been doing more than me in the last year!

I do some of the DIY, we decorate together. ds1 sees us doing that and still comes up with gems such as
'But mummy you aren't good at DIY' when I was finishing assembling an ikea desk. 'Errr really? Who has built the desk then?'. 'Oh yes you have but you aren't as good as daddy'

So yes it has to lived but sometimes it also has to be pointed out very clearly
Especially as anything I say is just met by a 'Yes but mummy what you do is always weir and different. It's not how things are done normally. Normal is the wife doing all the hw

All said very seriously.