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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

privilege and prostitution

282 replies

ezinma · 26/03/2014 15:15

Appearing in my social media today is one of those sharp and sassy thoughts for the day that I’m invited to approve by sharing. Where better to share it than here:

So, you are against prostitution. But you're an attractive person with a boyfriend. Who I assume you have sex with. That gives you privilege. Some people aren't so lucky. The only way they can get laid is by paying for it. Why do you think you have the right to experience one of life's fundamental experiences and others don't?

It’s from tumblr so we ought to make some allowances. Let’s, if we may, overlook the fact that I am a middle-aged frump with a civil partner; the debatable contention that sex, in and of itself, is one of life’s fundamental experiences; the erasure of women who aren’t “lucky” enough to have a boyfriend and whose right to A Fundamental Experience presumably requires them to seduce a partner using skills that cannot be withdrawn from a bank machine; and the regrettable (though now unavoidable) misuse of ‘privilege’ to refer to any old scenario where one group of people has a little bit more access to something than another group does. (Have I missed anything?)

What remains is the daring suggestion that a woman might be against prostitution because she is attractive. Since it's already well established that we fat old frumps are against prostitution — no glamorous john would waste his beer money on buying our flabby arses, and we are bitter about it! — then I’m left with only one conclusion: a woman’s attractiveness has no influence on her opinions about prostitution.

A lightbulb moment for me. Thanks, tumblr. Hmm

OP posts:
AnyFucker · 26/03/2014 20:53

Baleno, you are projecting your own use of prostituted women, right ?

They couldn't possibly get through 12 guys like you, right ?

scallopsrgreat · 26/03/2014 20:53

Well I suppose it depends on whether you consider women's bodies a 'service' FastLoris. That's where the entitlement is.

Baleno · 26/03/2014 20:51

A lot of prostitutes work alone in flats or in a brothel.

You've been very selective in your reading, baleno

Amusingly, I think the same of you.

FastLoris · 26/03/2014 20:51

CaptChaos -

I thought that someone who goes to a prostitute pays for specific services, and is then "entitled" to those services and no more. Is that not how it works?

If not - if someone, for example, pays for straight sex with a condom but then decides they want anal without one and forces the prostitution into it even though they'd made clear they don't offer it, then that's rape, surely. And if that's occurring in prostitution settings then isn't that an issue of how the industry is regulated and protected, rather than the morality of the industry's existing at all?

It doesn't change the argument about someone who DOES pay for a specific service freely offered, accepts that service and doesn't expect anything else. That person is not showing "entitlement", any more than someone who pays for any other kind of service.

scallopsrgreat · 26/03/2014 20:49

"There aren't enough hours in a day to drive around and meet 12 different men." Yeah coz all prostituted women have cars.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones · 26/03/2014 20:47

[weseeyou] Baleno.

scallopsrgreat · 26/03/2014 20:46

If men didn't feel entitled to have sex then why would they want to purchase it? Why not have sex with people who wanted to have sex with them? Because whatever spin you put on it, the only reason these women would have sex with them is if they were paid for it. Just like tradespeople wouldn't work for you unless you paid for them. And yes there is entitlement there on your part. You are expecting a service because you are paying for it. You have an entitlement that whatever needs fixing should be fixed (otherwise why find a tradesperson).

But these men paying for sex don't care whether the women want to be there, how vulnerable they maybe, the circumstances that got them to that point. They are interchangeable commodities. A bit like your tradesmen services. Except we are talking about women and their bodies and penetrating them.

AnyFucker · 26/03/2014 20:46

Baleno, you doubt her testimony then ?

FloraFox · 26/03/2014 20:44

A lot of prostitutes work alone in flats or in a brothel.

You've been very selective in your reading, baleno

CaptChaos · 26/03/2014 20:44

Still not listening then.

Baleno · 26/03/2014 20:43

her "friend" who had supplied her with accomodation and drove her to jobs

There aren't enough hours in a day to drive around and meet 12 different men.

and yes, she admitted to finding the men "repulsive"

does that bother you, Baleno?

Not at all. Subjectively repulsive is not the same as objectively repulsive.

FloraFox · 26/03/2014 20:42

I doubt that there are prostitutes who have sex with 10-12 clients a day. - hah! So much for being a neutral observer informed by listening.

CaptChaos · 26/03/2014 20:40

Agree AnyFucker

AnyFucker · 26/03/2014 20:38

P*unternet should put anyone straight who misses the point about what men who pay for sex think they are "entitled" to

CaptChaos · 26/03/2014 20:35

I can see how men who exploit prostituted women think they're entitled to sex, because they just take it regardless of the consent or attitude of the other person.

They pay, therefore they can do what they like. This is entitlement. Men who use prostitutes feel they have paid to empty their balls into whichever orifice they choose, and that's what they will do, regardless of the consent or attitude of the owner of those orifices. This isn't just a random belief. This is what the punters themselves say.

AnyFucker · 26/03/2014 20:34

and yes, she admitted to finding the men "repulsive"

does that bother you, Baleno?

AnyFucker · 26/03/2014 20:33

men who use prostitutes are, by very definition, repulsive

and I won't name her, but there was a prostitute posting regularly on a different thread who was "servicing" at least 10-12 men in one working session

this was normal for her, and she was doing it to support her child and pay off "debts" to her "friend" who had supplied her with accomodation and drove her to jobs

Baleno · 26/03/2014 20:29

The idea that servicing 10, 12 however many repulsive men a day could be, in any way, okay makes me wonder if the defenders of prostitution have ever had decent sex.

I doubt that there are prostitutes who have sex with 10-12 clients a day. If there are, they must be a minority, because numbers don't add up. I remember a self-declared ex-prostitute being exposed because she declared such high numbers, whilst actual prostitutes, working in the same place she said, declared that on a "full day" their number was 4.

And I also doubt that most clients of prostitutes are repulsive men, unless you deem average men to be repulsive.

FastLoris · 26/03/2014 20:25

I don't understand how men going to prostitutes means they feel "entitled" to sex.

I can see how rapists think they're entitled to sex, because they just take it regardless of the consent or attitude of the other person. I can also see how people having sex with prostitutes who have been trafficked and are working under duress could be seen as much the same thing.

But is someone has sex with a prostitute who makes his or her own decision as an individual to make that exchange of services for money, then where does "entitlement" come into it?

When I buy something from my corner shop, or hire a tradesman to do a job in my house, it doesn't mean I feel "entitled" to those goods or services. It just means someone is offering them and I choose to take them up on that offer, at an agreed price. If they weren't offering, or we couldn't agree a price, then I would accept that I don't get them. There's no entitlement.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch · 26/03/2014 20:21

" The idea that servicing 10, 12 however many repulsive men a day could be, in any way, okay makes me wonder if the defenders of prostitution have ever had decent sex. Because surely if you'd had decent sex, you'd find the idea of a woman forced to put up with that out of financial necessity abhorent."

This.

FloraFox · 26/03/2014 20:14

Grin sabrina

SabrinaMulhollandJjones · 26/03/2014 20:11

Great if you are having champagne then a romp with Richard Gere every other week.

Ooh yes, Flora, Wink and you get to drive fast cars, to go shopping with lots of dosh, and outsmart the snooty shops assistants, and you get to go to the polo, and outsmart the bitchy posh gals, then you get swept off by Prince Charming to live in his penthouse. Prostitution's just great, innit? A fairy tale no less.

AnyFucker · 26/03/2014 20:07

I don't know why feminists despise sex so much.

Schoolboy error.

Personally, I find the people who romanticise and raise sex to some sort of religious experience are the ones with the biggest hang ups and entitlement attitude about it.

FloraFox · 26/03/2014 20:06

Btw, I know several people who have never had sex. They are not dead.

FloraFox · 26/03/2014 20:05

Lurcio I couldn't agree more! It's part of the myth of prostitution as the perfect job for nymphos, they're loving all this great sex and they'd do it even if they weren't paid so they might as well get paid for it. Great if you are having champagne then a romp with Richard Gere every other week. Selling access to your holes to 10-12 men a day for their gratification is not sex.