Porn is violence against women

Porn is becoming more violent, and violent porn is becoming more mainstream.

Yesterday I googled 'porn' - the top site was pornhub. On the first page of pornhub was a section "18 and abused" - featuring an actress who didn't, to me, look a day over 15.

Glamourising and fetishising the abuse of teenagers is 2 clicks away from a google search of the word 'porn'.

Well, that plan doesn't seem to be working.

Porn has been getting steadily more hardcore and racism is rife.

The porn industry is rotten, it is also very big and very rich, and a few people making cuddly porn and campaigning for condom use (which is ignored) is not about to change it. It is naive beyond belief to suggest otherwise.

Porn (the vast majority of it) is not sex as entertainment, it is eroticized violence against women as entertainment.

The same way we deal with the racism in all mainstream entertaiment media - mentioning it, criticizing it, encouraging the production of material that isn't racist.

And that's what we do with porn as well: campaign for safe and fair working conditions, encourage and support the people making material with well-treated performers and diverse, interesting themes.

There is nothing wrong with sex as performance, sex as entertainment, watching others engage in sex, exploring different sexual activities. What we need is more, better made porn, not stigma and censorship.

Those of you who watch porn or think we shouldn't condemn the industry, how do you justify the racism in it?

I can see that you have squared the misogyny (or don't see it), but how on earth are you able to justify the racism to yourselves?

Porn is full of racist stereotypes and language. Doesn't that bother you?

In this day and age, many people still don't really care about violence against women, but it is fairly unusual to come across people who will cheerfully go along with racism. Does the wanking close down the part of the brain that processes social injustice? Or does the racism not matter when it is mainly against women

I condemn the entire industry too Red because, like Pooglie says the vast majority is primarily based on male fantasy. The increasing availability and acceptance of porn along with the internet means that the current and future generations are being "educated" about sex this way. Men and women believing porn is about the enjoyment of the male.

I base this partly on personal experience; porn enthusiasts are selfish and pushy in bed. I spent years as a youngster being the dutiful 'cool girlfriend' and doing the porn 'performance' in bed. I'm of full of cringe and regret and I can't believe people defend this shit.

Agreed+++. It is naive to ignore the misogyny inherent in the porn industry. The power differential is writ large. All porn results in the subjugation of women ultimately because it is primarily based on male fantasies of how women can be used for sexual gratification e.g. even though the dominatrix is based on a male requirement to be overwhelmed and controlled, the scenario is still dictated by the needs of the male. Women collude with this idea that somehow porn and sex-working are empowering. They can never truly empower women because the roots of porn are driven by the male expectations of women as objects in the sexual fantasy. It doesn't matter how much money a woman makes from it. Money provides some independence but this should not be confused with power.
I wonder how many women in the porn industry would switch jobs if they could make £500 a day in retail??

Well nobody makes any choice divorced from their social conditioning. However there is nothing wrong with attempting to ensure that social conditioning ensures as many people as possible are able to self actualise their lives to their fullest potential, and just by virtue of being female individuals really shouldn't be handicapped for that.

I think I understand why "no free choice under patriarchy" leads you to a bleak place, although whiny is perhaps a bit combative. However deconstructing social conditioning invites possible solutions, so dialogues like these are well worth having.

Disagree with the OP. It's possible to recognise - and oppose - the harmful and exploitative conditions faced by some porn performers without condeming an entire form of entertainment.

And I'm getting tired of this whiny 'no woman can make a free choice under patriarchy' argument as well. SO why don't we all just fucking kill ourselves and have done with it?

I agree

Art, this is a board to discuss feminism, not a board for feminists, so not everyone who posts necessarily agrees with the OP.

Secondly, some feminists (and other people) may believe that porn is wrong but disagree that it equates to violence. So the OP is not the same as saying, "equal pay is a good thing" in terms of universality.

Well I suppose the crib notes version is who gets to decide the truth

As someone smarter than me said, there is no truth, only perception. And whatever society we live in, we are never truly insulated from it's influence, are we? Can anyone ever make a truly independent decision? Can we separate the decisions of Pamela Anderson or Paris Hilton from those of a person living on the breadline?

It's a bit whoosh at the moment, as my 3 youngest are back from nursery and not getting on with the drawing activity I have tried to occupy them with!

I will read again later, but thank you very much for taking the time out to explain it for me. Much appreciated. Perhaps I need a start at the beginning book list, background history, ideologies etc. Any ideas?

I did study social sciences at uni, and i'm not quite as moronic as i may sound, but I have dumbed down a lot over the years, and would love to learn up. Thanks.

Ah, I get you.

How can you get around the fact though, that every supposedly free choice is not though, in a patriarchal society? I mean other than over throw it, how can you have it now?

I'm new to feminism and still learning.

Buffy

I've never really thought of it in terms of are men suffering the same, and then it would be equal. (i'm not sure if i have misunderstood you, or if that is what you meant) I mostly think of it being a guy thing to post it, but what concerns me more, is how many young naive people do it, and then years down the line realise the massive implications of doing so.

Things like, family seeing it, future children seeing it, new partners seeing it, future employees etc.

My dd1 is 13 and tbh it's scaring the hell out of me, especially as she has confided that she has been pressured for underwear pictures already.

I couldn't stumble across it, I have no desire to seek it out and watch it.

I prefer to enjoy my own little sex show, that I participate in without the cameras rolling.

Enlighten, it's a fair point about poster's motives, and whether it's posted with consent or not. I also wonder what happens when someone stumbles across footage of someone they know. Would make for an interesting conversation next time you see them at the coffee machine, I suppose!

I have little doubt that some people do it for kicks. Different strokes ...It's a separate issue to a massive meat-grinder of an industry though, at least in my book.