Radfem 2013 and the MRAs

notfluffy, I try to be as good a radfem as I can be, and I would love you to tell me where I'm spouting 'filth'. Or any of the other rad fems on this thread.

Or are we once again talking about those hypothetical rad fems who don't exist? Or people who aren't actually speaking at radfem 2013?

This conversation feels a bit as if you didn't read the thread, you just jumped in assuming things - unfair?

Sorry, you still haven't said in what way the conference is discriminatory

Have you seen the filth some of the RadFem followers spew about trans women? I'd be distancing myself from that lot. Hateful doesn't quite cover it. I don't like it from men and I don't like it just because they have vaginas either.

If the EDL wanted to hold a conference there I'm pretty sure they'd get the bums rush too.

And which transwoman would subject herself to speakers like Cathy Brennan, google that little peach.

They are as hateful as any MRA group I have ever come across.

No worries!

Oops, sorry, cross posted with LRD

In what way was it being discriminatory notfluffyatall?

Erm ... how was inviting transwomen to attend discriminatory? Please do explain that one.

The London Irish Centre quite rightly cancelled the event because it was being discriminatory. It doesn't matter who brought that to the attention of the LIC, that is a separate discussion.

If you too are happy to discriminate against transgender women then you will celebrate this. I hate discrimination, it weakens the feminist cause to discriminate against a whole group of women.

Shame on anyone who does.

I like 'sisters', though Sister Tunip sounds a bit nun-like.
I don't understand 'spot me with part of your light' but I am holding Uranio in the light in a Quaker sort of way.
In fact, I think I will do that to the MRAs, too. And Elohim.

Mmm, I see what you mean. I am used to 'pet' and 'love' so I don't think the familiarity bothers me. I used to enjoy the very earnest communist bloke I knew, who liked to refer to his mates as 'comrades'.

I find it way over familiar, maybe that's just my British reserve shining through!

I have to admit, in a normal context, I quite like 'sisters' as a form of address. There aren't enough nice ways to address a group of women.

(I've wanted to say this ever since I Saw it in Moesha when I was like, 13)

Sister? My parents didn't tell me anything about you! (Flicks hair)

I think it behoves uranio and anyone else to think for a millisecond before posting, is all.

Night, basil.

Are you sure that's what uranio was doing?

His postings are so incoherent that I'm not entirely sure.

Anyway really off to bed now. Damn you Question Time, Andrew Neill and Mumsnet.

Oh d'you reckon it's one of those?

Nuff said.

Andrew Neil's saying good night to me, so I'm off to bed.

Good night.

Though, I will say, it is disgusting to compare forced abortion to a woman's 'choice' over how own body.

basil - or, alternatively, we could sit back and wait until HQ ban Bob/Edd/Mike/their little friends.

"A question for sister TunipTheVegedude;
"In China alone it is estimated that over a million girl babies are aborted every year"...
I never knew that, I was informed that was a fake news. I was informed that the controlled demographic did not deal with sex. I was lucky to come here. But anyhow what's the deal with the gender of not born babies? I mean, we fought hard to have the abortion to not give birth to babies, our body our choice, after all we all know abortion does not deal with interruption of life of human beings; so I can't find much sense in defining the gender of not living beings; can you spot me with part of you light, sister Tunip?"

Um
What?

you only need to google, honey
this came up first for me take a look

And surely you heard about women having forced late stage abortions in China (feminist issue) when you were growing up? How old are you I'm surprised you haven't heard about that.

So look at that
Look at other parts of asia
Look at preference for male children resulting in a heavily skewed population
Look at places where women cannot vote
Look at places where women are not allowed rights to their children
Look at places where rape is legal
Look at places where women earn less than men for the same work
Look at places where women and girls are at extremely high risk of rape from organised groups
Look at places where girls are denied an education...

Look at the world and open your eyes. Watch the news and notice how many reports come from places where there are no women to be seen, anywhere.

Then make your sarcy comments about having fun. I don't find this subject a joke, you clearly do. Yes fucking hilarious.

These are brilliant ideas uranio.

Also what we could do:

Make men do half the housework and childcare, so that they actually know how to look after their own children on divorce.

Get women to commit as much serious crime as men, so that we're justified in locking them up in equal numbers.

Make women half of our elected representatives, half of judges, half of board directors, half of leaders in education, medicine, law and media.

Make men half of all rape and sexual assault victims in the world.

Pay men and women the same wage for equal work (this still doesn't happen).

Saturate public space with pictures of men wearing considerably less clothing while posing like this

Anything else?

Hi girls!
Having fun? Good, good.
First of all congrats for the level of discussion; finally I found a place where MRA topics are addressed and debated, I feel at home here. Not the usual stuff...MRA do this and that, because they are losers, or they feel "men" are losing ground. No, finally a place where MRA are fought and debunked on the ground of merit. Great.
A question: the "M" of MRA stands for "Misogynistic"? This question popped up in my head because ti seems that the acronym does not suit our taste, sisters; it can't be the "R" of rights, nothing wrong with that, we use it all the time; and the "A" is quite an innocent letter recalling advocates, this word does not hurt me, does it hurt you? I guess no. So it must be the "M" that makes us uncomfortable, but I can't figure intolerance to "men" so the "M" should mean something more vicious...

A question for sister TunipTheVegedude;
"In China alone it is estimated that over a million girl babies are aborted every year"...
I never knew that, I was informed that was a fake news. I was informed that the controlled demographic did not deal with sex. I was lucky to come here. But anyhow what's the deal with the gender of not born babies? I mean, we fought hard to have the abortion to not give birth to babies, our body our choice, after all we all know abortion does not deal with interruption of life of human beings; so I can't find much sense in defining the gender of not living beings; can you spot me with part of you light, sister Tunip?

Sisters, i do not know if I can join you at the Radfem disccussion, so I'll kindly ask someone of you if she can raise, on my behalf, few points on which I would like to have feedbacks:

• we strive for equality, even if MRAs (and most men) do not get it; I think that we should acknowledge that we do not communicate properly, it can't be only their fault unless we are inferring men/MRA are stupid. So I propose that we put in our agenda a plan to create the social conditions for which the detainee population will be composed for the 50% of women; that will debunk all their misogynistic attitudes.
• and when it comes to those F4J, let's prove them our commitment to equality; starting 2014 half of exclusive child custodies will be awarded to fathers, by law. Will shut their fucking mouth!
• regarding the pensions system, I really cannot bear them anymore; i need a break! Please sisters let women retire 4 years later than men, so those losers will be happy and women will be more empowered.

Love, love, love

That's true, flora, but I was using the 'murdering babies' not to be disingenuous but because I'm not terribly well up on what people do say or whether it's true.

While I don't believe the "cotton ceiling" people are representative of all trans people, they are real and do discuss this even on general feminist websites (like feministing). I actually don't believe that there are any rad fems who do advocate murdering babies.

Yes Kim totally and that's the thing extremist views or even unusual views are often raised. So when people say well radfems want to murder babies the whole cotton ceiling thing needs to be raised IYSWIM.

I am not surprised you have issues with some stuff said - i do too - but like all political groupings there will always be an extreme wing / people you don't agree with etc.

On balance maybe better to let people join rather than make it so closed that potentially only the more extreme people are left? Stop the meetings, drive them underground, make them scary you cut the membership back...

Some things absolutely you can't say there are laws but IME at fem meetings it's what you would expect. sensible food and how are we going to make things better for women.

I find it a bit odd that MRA bandwagon // certain trans-activists genuinely believe that this is a major conversation at these meetings. Do the even believe that? There is so much to talk about globally, and of course the difficulties faced by various "minority" groups exist eg gay people trans people poor people etc, at these meetings the focus is female people through pre birth, birth, childhood etc etc. and there's enough to think about with all the "missing girls", reproductive health, abortion rights being eroded, porn culture, etc etc ad infinitum. What is being protested is just...

I don't know.

I imagine (possibly naively) that the sort of people who convene conferences to talk about getting through the 'cotton ceiling' are about as representatives as the hypothetical rad fems who don't want to bring up male babies.

However, the fact remains that women have been campaigning for legal protections for generations, and we only got rape in marriage criminalized in 1991. Transactivists have been campaigning for a much shorter time, and already, legally, the definition of women is being changed without women getting a say. Obviously, I can understand why ordinary people who're trans are nothing but pleased, and I wouldn't expect any different - why shouldn't they be? But it is indicative of how society sees us all.